What a fucking scam....

[NutNut]

FIST getting ppl to bid based on a false pretense is not right IMO. It's like getting ppl to donate to a cause and using a fake cause, supplying them with something at the end of the donation does not make it right. Reminds me of people that setup auctions for the troops and then steal the $, the simple fact that it is to "help" one of their own will drive bids up.

 

[F.I.S.T.]

FIST getting ppl to bid based on a false pretense is not right IMO. It's like getting ppl to donate to a cause and using a fake cause, supplying them with something at the end of the donation does not make it right. Reminds me of people that setup auctions for the troops and then steal the $, the simple fact that it is to "help" one of their own will drive bids up.

All im saying is that an auction is set up,members bid on that auction and get great products at a great price.How he set it up is not the issue.I agree that pretending to be someone else is completely wrong,no question with that.My main point is that as long as members are getting what they bid on,there is no stealing involved.

From what I gathered from this is pain/tf/xtreme has sponsors donating gear for an auction in which members bid on this auction.The winner gets his winnings and the money goes to pain.Ass was said earlier,it would seem the ones who are losing out are the sponsors,in a sense.By donating their goods,they are also exposing members to their product in the hopes that the reviews will and most times do get them more business.So are they really losing out.Hell when I owned/ran boards sponsors would practically beg me to take free gear to try it so I could tell my members how good it was so they would get more business.I am not influenced by others as I think most of you have found out so I didn't want to take gear because to me,it would obligate me in their minds to bump them even if they did wrong.Not me,so it wasnt worth it.

But again,no matter how the donations are being made as long as they get their winnings,then there is no real harm IMHO.Not sticking up for pain,nor would I if members didnt get their gear,but they have been.

 

[F.I.S.T.]

Oh and I forgot to address one thing you said about posing as someone to get the bid count up.Thats what happens in any auction brother.Not just on AAS boards.There are always plants to raise the bid.Nature of the beast.Business man.As long as members are still getting a good amount of gear at a good price,less than it would be if they were to buy it directly from the source,then once again its all good.But to go even further,even if the bids go higher than what you would pay buying direct and a member is willing to pay,than its all good.Who am I to say "HEY STUPID WHY ARE YOU PAYING SO MUCH FOR THAT"? Not my place.I can help look after my fellow members but cant tell them not to pay for an auction if they want it.As long as they get what they won.

 

[NutNut]

F.I.S.T the nature of the beast isn't to lie about where the $ is going, that's scummy and no matter what I won't accept that as proper practice or "OK" nor can it be justified in my eyes. We can agree to disagree but to me it is the principle of the matter. If you use a lie to get me to bid more $ so you can profit it's a con. Guess I should have said con members out of $.

 

[F.I.S.T.]

F.I.S.T the nature of the beast isn't to lie about where the $ is going, that's scummy and no matter what I won't accept that as proper practice or "OK" nor can it be justified in my eyes. We can agree to disagree but to me it is the principle of the matter. If you use a lie to get me to bid more $ so you can profit it's a con. Guess I should have said con members out of $.

I still just don't see how its a con? They are getting what they pay for.There's no con. And yes,plants at auctions are absolutely the nature of the beast.You think at an art auction they don't have plants raising the bid?Of course they do.Do you think when bidding on a business they don't have plants?HELL YES they do.Been there and done that man.I know for a fact that they do it because ive met plants at auctions I was at.Met at a bar and after a few drinks you get to know people too much sometimes.LOL

His lying about who he is is wrong.His raising the bid by posing as someone else bidding is morally wrong,but not a con.Morals don't come into play in business man.Unless you're stealing from someone.If you're giving someone what they willingly pay for,theres no crime involved.Like I said whether they get their winnings at a great price or even higher than "retail" has no relevance,im not anyones daddy on the boards.Im not here to wipe anyones nose.If they want to pay a price for something,then so be it.Would I pay higher than what somethings worth? Most of the time no.Unless I really want to help someone out.But what I would do is not anyones business,nor is their business mine.As long as they get their product,no crime.

 

[ajdos]

All I can say is this:

I was on a board years ago owned by someone who strongarmed his sources and auctioned off the gear for the "board", the auctions never had reasons.

TF used the hurricane that devasted New Orleans, a fake mod who was proabably acutally him who was stranded in Mexico, and then to help "pain" (himself) its one thing to auction things off but to do it under the premise that the exorbitant prices should be driven up higher since they are to "help" someone is no better than a fucking scam.
Its a dishonest premise just to fleece his members and stuff money in his own greedy pocket.
He sold CS right out from under the members and jumped ship, made that BoP board which by the way is constituted by 85% fake comp generated members, that hack is easy to install.
More dishonesty to lure in sources who thing he has 4000 members when he really only has a few 100.
Just all dishonest and with no integrity, cant believe I was the guys admin for those years.

 

[NutNut]

con as a verb: Persuade (someone) to do or believe something, typically by use of a deception.

con as a noun: An instance of deceiving or tricking someone.

Now can you see how pretending to be someone else and getting the bid raised due to a false sense of need is in fact a con?

 

[F.I.S.T.]

All I can say is this:

I was on a board years ago owned by someone who strongarmed his sources and auctioned off the gear for the "board", the auctions never had reasons.

TF used the hurricane that devasted New Orleans, a fake mod who was proabably acutally him who was stranded in Mexico, and then to help "pain" (himself) its one thing to auction things off but to do it under the premise that the exorbitant prices should be driven up higher since they are to "help" someone is no better than a fucking scam.
Its a dishonest premise just to fleece his members and stuff money in his own greedy pocket.
He sold CS right out from under the members and jumped ship, made that BoP board which by the way is constituted by 85% fake comp generated members, that hack is easy to install.
More dishonesty to lure in sources who thing he has 4000 members when he really only has a few 100.
Just all dishonest and with no integrity, cant believe I was the guys admin for those years.

AJ,I am not disputing what he has done in the past as you being on his staff would know better than I.Im only commenting on the auctions going on.Those things that he supposedly did,are fucked up for sure.If they happened,I agree that they are wrong.Not questioning that.Im only saying that running an auction where someone gets something in return is not a crime.We're all grown ups and can make choices as such.We can help advise others that are new but thats it.No matter how many times you tell someone not to buy shit from anyone other than a known sponsor,they continue to do it and get scammed.Their own fault.

But getting something for your money is not the same as getting scammed.

 

[F.I.S.T.]

con as a verb: Persuade (someone) to do or believe something, typically by use of a deception.

con as a noun: An instance of deceiving or tricking someone.

Now can you see how pretending to be someone else and getting the bid raised due to a false sense of need is in fact a con?

The webster answers are cute,but unfortunately no-one will ever get convicted in any court for doing something immoral.Convictions are made from crimes,not what is not nice.Now can you see how your scam and con theory are not just?Pretending to be someone else to deceive others to get a higher bid is REALLY NOT NICE.I agree,its really naughty.Not a crime.Members are getting what they paid for.Did I say that already? I'll say it again because it sounds really important......"THEY ARE GETTING WHAT THEY PAY FOR" No court could ever convict anyone of this.Sorry.If they choose to pay for it,at whatever price it is,thats their choice Nut.I don't wipe others noses.I advise,I try to educate,but I don't hold their hand or change their diapers.

 

[biguglynewf]

AJ,I am not disputing what he has done in the past as you being on his staff would know better than I.Im only commenting on the auctions going on.Those things that he supposedly did,are fucked up for sure.If they happened,I agree that they are wrong.Not questioning that.Im only saying that running an auction where someone gets something in return is not a crime.We're all grown ups and can make choices as such.We can help advise others that are new but thats it.No matter how many times you tell someone not to buy shit from anyone other than a known sponsor,they continue to do it and get scammed.Their own fault.

But getting something for your money is not the same as getting scammed.

Running it under false pretenses is shady as fuck though. And I think that is what nut is saying here. Hence conning the members to drive up bid prices.

If I told people that I had cancer and allowed peopled to raise money for my treament and didn;t even have it that would be a con no? Extreme running an auction for Pain is indeed a con no matter which way we try to slice it.

Conning and scamming can be exclusive of one another in this light if we want to try to dissect it this way IMO. Crimes to be proven in a criminal court are not really relevant here.

Regardless of the differences in opinion.....

What is going on is shady and should be posted everywhere so people know the type of person they are dealing with. Especially since this kind of BS has been pulled before.

 

[ajdos]

AJ,I am not disputing what he has done in the past as you being on his staff would know better than I.Im only commenting on the auctions going on.Those things that he supposedly did,are fucked up for sure.If they happened,I agree that they are wrong.Not questioning that.Im only saying that running an auction where someone gets something in return is not a crime.We're all grown ups and can make choices as such.We can help advise others that are new but thats it.No matter how many times you tell someone not to buy shit from anyone other than a known sponsor,they continue to do it and get scammed.Their own fault.

But getting something for your money is not the same as getting scammed.

The auctions are what they are, in of them selves they are not dishonest.
The premise he uses to get his members to willingly over pay is dishonest...and in very bad taste, I mean really? He wants to ride the sympathy of a horrific event like that?
All I can say is a person like him is of low moral character and has no real place owning a forum whatsoever...hes just fleecing his members, just like Crazy May.

 

[F.I.S.T.]

But getting something for your money is not the same as getting scammed.

Running it under false pretenses is shady as fuck though. And I think that is what nut is saying here. Hence conninghte members to drive up bid prices.

If I told people that I had cancer and allowed peopled to raise money for my treament and didn;t even have it that would be a con no? Extreme running an auction for Pain is indeed a con no amtter which way we try to slice it.

Conning and scamming can be exclusive of one another. Crimes to be proven in a criminal court are not really relevant here.

Regardless of the differences in opinion - what is going on is shady and should be posted everywhere so people know the type of person they are dealing with. Especially since this kind of BS has been pulled before.

I understand that completely and agree.Saying someone has a disease to get money is wrong.Those that went on at CS are fucked up.Im only talking about the ones ive seen on BOP.Thats what this thread was started over.It is wrong to lie about such a tragic thing to get money.The ones over there that I saw were not under that premise.Now as I said,i am not over there as much now so maybe im missing something,but am only commenting on the auctions I know of there and whos gotten what.