gotclen
VIP Member
- Oct 20, 2011
- 1,099
- 409
I'm such a light weight. I tend to just take a 10iu bottle and use 3.3 iu per day for 3 days.
Then go to next bottle. Or lets say it is a 18iu bottle I divide by 5 days and run 3.6iu a day.
That being said I'm going to try the greys at 5iu a day. I have never even dreamed of 10 to 15iu a day.
I really question the true benefit of that much gh. At the end of a run of that much GH what real changes have you seen Bigbx? Did you get a real increase of lean mass? Did you become razor ripped? Big if you can will you share what you feel were your real world results of those higher doses? Tks, GC
Then go to next bottle. Or lets say it is a 18iu bottle I divide by 5 days and run 3.6iu a day.
That being said I'm going to try the greys at 5iu a day. I have never even dreamed of 10 to 15iu a day.
I really question the true benefit of that much gh. At the end of a run of that much GH what real changes have you seen Bigbx? Did you get a real increase of lean mass? Did you become razor ripped? Big if you can will you share what you feel were your real world results of those higher doses? Tks, GC
big bx
VIP Member
- Nov 30, 2011
- 816
- 203
I will say at 12 or more iu's split 3 times was where I definitely noticed a difference. Just looked better, fuller. This was while dieting. I will say with slin it's definitely worth it. I can see how guys get big an stay lean. I went from 228 to 253 in 4 weeks using both. Still looked damn good too. Not watery or fat. 6 pack an full. But, you better eat an eat alot. Cause the more you eat the better you look. Even dieting the more you eat the better you look. Not junk. Clean food. Im not talking 3 or 4 thousand calories more like six. And it hard to do that. Just counting that many is. Don't get me wrong, I had some junk. But only 2 days a week.
magnus82
Member
- Apr 20, 2012
- 27
- 18
Here is a write up I did. I think to maximize gh it has to be run with slin and at doses preventing anti-bodies. Correct dosing of each is like 1+1=4. Below is my recommendation on how to maximize gh with slin. Based on the studies, this protocol prevents anti-bodies allowing to be run safely for longer periods. The addition of peps keep the bodies own production going as well.
First I will explain each compound, it's role in muscle building, and their synergy with one another.
Slin-
Slin is the most anabolic hormone in the human body. When slin is released into the body, it's nutrient partitioning affects are mind blowing. It also increases protein synthesis within the muscle when used with bcaas. In addition to this, the correct amount of slin will increase gh receptors by 400 to 500%. The key is to not do to little, or to much, as it will have a negative impact on gh receptors. So what is the magic number. Blood levels of 10 nmol/L. Studies have shown it to be no less than 5ius and no more than 7ius.
Growth Hormone
Growth hormone (GH) promotes protein anabolism with mechanisms different from insulin. It does not affect the rates of whole-body proteolysis [breakdown] but decreases those of amino acid oxidation. The sparing effect on amino acid oxidation results in a greater rate of their incorporation into proteins with a net protein anabolic effect.
So Growth Hormone decreases amino acid oxidation (or break down for energy). This should have the effect of preserving key amino acids in that very important amino acid pool. This means that muscle protein synthesis or even increased muscle protein synthesis induced by insulin will be prolonged because there will be a larger pool of raw material (aminos) to draw from.
Mod GRF (1-29)/GHRP2
The use of these gh release peptides minimizes the use of gh and given the correct timing, allows gh to piggyback the grf/ghrp2 pulse. Dr. Alpha's testing determined 100mcg each of grf/ghrp2 to be the saturation point.
So putting it together, a fast actin insulin like Humalog is to be used, followed by peps, then gh. This should be done 2 to 3 times a week, 2 to 4 times a day with a minimum of 3.5hrs in between.
Protocol
Slin 5-7 ius
Wait 10 min
100mcg each mod GRF/ghrp2 IM
Wait 10 min
2 ius gh IM
The following protocol has a tremendous cell volumizing affect. This cellular hydration keeps you highly anabolic. One thing to keep in mind, all essential amino acids must be present at the time of administration to occur.. Preferably intraworkout with modern bcaas, creatine, and glutamine.
First I will explain each compound, it's role in muscle building, and their synergy with one another.
Slin-
Slin is the most anabolic hormone in the human body. When slin is released into the body, it's nutrient partitioning affects are mind blowing. It also increases protein synthesis within the muscle when used with bcaas. In addition to this, the correct amount of slin will increase gh receptors by 400 to 500%. The key is to not do to little, or to much, as it will have a negative impact on gh receptors. So what is the magic number. Blood levels of 10 nmol/L. Studies have shown it to be no less than 5ius and no more than 7ius.
Growth Hormone
Growth hormone (GH) promotes protein anabolism with mechanisms different from insulin. It does not affect the rates of whole-body proteolysis [breakdown] but decreases those of amino acid oxidation. The sparing effect on amino acid oxidation results in a greater rate of their incorporation into proteins with a net protein anabolic effect.
So Growth Hormone decreases amino acid oxidation (or break down for energy). This should have the effect of preserving key amino acids in that very important amino acid pool. This means that muscle protein synthesis or even increased muscle protein synthesis induced by insulin will be prolonged because there will be a larger pool of raw material (aminos) to draw from.
Mod GRF (1-29)/GHRP2
The use of these gh release peptides minimizes the use of gh and given the correct timing, allows gh to piggyback the grf/ghrp2 pulse. Dr. Alpha's testing determined 100mcg each of grf/ghrp2 to be the saturation point.
So putting it together, a fast actin insulin like Humalog is to be used, followed by peps, then gh. This should be done 2 to 3 times a week, 2 to 4 times a day with a minimum of 3.5hrs in between.
Protocol
Slin 5-7 ius
Wait 10 min
100mcg each mod GRF/ghrp2 IM
Wait 10 min
2 ius gh IM
The following protocol has a tremendous cell volumizing affect. This cellular hydration keeps you highly anabolic. One thing to keep in mind, all essential amino acids must be present at the time of administration to occur.. Preferably intraworkout with modern bcaas, creatine, and glutamine.
Dr_jitsu
Senior Member
- Apr 21, 2013
- 222
- 16
First of all, awesome rear double bi....I am in touch with the competitive circuit and if the rest of you looks as good, you should be on stage.
Back to your question, 10 plus IU's a day is definitely unhealthy, your organs and god knows what (cancer) else can happen. Having said that, if you are getting on stage, it is only about winning, not health. If you can afford 15 iu's of pharm, go for it. OK, back to the OT.
There have been a few good studies recently that can provide a good degree of info. One done on children found that going e2d preserved the bodies own ability to produce GH.
Other studies have looked at the potential of GH to cause cancer. The logic is simple, since GH makes things grow, it probably makes cancer cells grow, right?
Not really. First, the study showed that LOW GH is actually carcinogenic. The logic is that low GH means that the body is less able to produce antibodies to fight cancer cells.
Now, admitedly, this theory is something I extrapolated from several studies and logic. The safest amount of GH is a dosage that puts you in the high normal range. This range is based upon your IGF-1 levels. Yes, there is a lot of noise out there trumpeting HPCL testing, but IGF-1 is still the best measure going (especially if you also have blood serum and Mass specs). Real scientists doing real research still use IGF-1.
OK, so here is the theory: High normal levels make the immune system stronger, more able to fight off cancer, more able to heal injuries and in general have a more robust ability to heal and regenerate itself.
I am an old man, and I do every test possible to my GH, which is a Chinese generic. I do 3 iu's e2d, or 1.5 iu's a day. The IGF-1 range for my age is 60-190 ng.
I tested at an average of 70 ngs prior to GH. I have 3.5 years of data. My IGF-1 went up to 182ng.
Have I gained a lot of muscle? No, maybe 6-8 lbs in a year. But here is the crazy part: My worst body parts (chest bi's) have improved dramatically from GH.
Regular steroids make my strongest body parts (legs, tri's, back) improve more so than my weakest. I eat stupid amounts of food, porterhouse steak and a whole plate of Smores last night. My wife is in a perpetual state of shock, lol.
I plan on running low dose GH for the rest of my life.
So, to summarize: low GH, bad, high normal GH good.
Now OP, I need to know your plans: If you are after an IFBB pro card (and the pay is shit for every one but the top 10....you can make good money other ways) then yes, run 10 plus iu's. If you just have a particular amatuer show you want to win, go for it. No one can ever take away the fact that you are a champion, so IMO no price can be put on that.
If you are after long term health, want to be an athlete at age 65, then go low dose for the rest vof your life.
Back to your question, 10 plus IU's a day is definitely unhealthy, your organs and god knows what (cancer) else can happen. Having said that, if you are getting on stage, it is only about winning, not health. If you can afford 15 iu's of pharm, go for it. OK, back to the OT.
There have been a few good studies recently that can provide a good degree of info. One done on children found that going e2d preserved the bodies own ability to produce GH.
Other studies have looked at the potential of GH to cause cancer. The logic is simple, since GH makes things grow, it probably makes cancer cells grow, right?
Not really. First, the study showed that LOW GH is actually carcinogenic. The logic is that low GH means that the body is less able to produce antibodies to fight cancer cells.
Now, admitedly, this theory is something I extrapolated from several studies and logic. The safest amount of GH is a dosage that puts you in the high normal range. This range is based upon your IGF-1 levels. Yes, there is a lot of noise out there trumpeting HPCL testing, but IGF-1 is still the best measure going (especially if you also have blood serum and Mass specs). Real scientists doing real research still use IGF-1.
OK, so here is the theory: High normal levels make the immune system stronger, more able to fight off cancer, more able to heal injuries and in general have a more robust ability to heal and regenerate itself.
I am an old man, and I do every test possible to my GH, which is a Chinese generic. I do 3 iu's e2d, or 1.5 iu's a day. The IGF-1 range for my age is 60-190 ng.
I tested at an average of 70 ngs prior to GH. I have 3.5 years of data. My IGF-1 went up to 182ng.
Have I gained a lot of muscle? No, maybe 6-8 lbs in a year. But here is the crazy part: My worst body parts (chest bi's) have improved dramatically from GH.
Regular steroids make my strongest body parts (legs, tri's, back) improve more so than my weakest. I eat stupid amounts of food, porterhouse steak and a whole plate of Smores last night. My wife is in a perpetual state of shock, lol.
I plan on running low dose GH for the rest of my life.
So, to summarize: low GH, bad, high normal GH good.
Now OP, I need to know your plans: If you are after an IFBB pro card (and the pay is shit for every one but the top 10....you can make good money other ways) then yes, run 10 plus iu's. If you just have a particular amatuer show you want to win, go for it. No one can ever take away the fact that you are a champion, so IMO no price can be put on that.
If you are after long term health, want to be an athlete at age 65, then go low dose for the rest vof your life.
big bx
VIP Member
- Nov 30, 2011
- 816
- 203
^^^ Definitely not after a pro card. Gonna give a particular show one more go. Only competed twice in 10 years. I basically wanna look great an be healthy.
I was looking at a study the other day that stated test alone made your heart grow. But, test an gh made it grow more. I believe it was a Finnish study on bodybuilders. Kinda made me nervous. Cause I just did 1500mg test an 12 iu gh.
I was looking at a study the other day that stated test alone made your heart grow. But, test an gh made it grow more. I believe it was a Finnish study on bodybuilders. Kinda made me nervous. Cause I just did 1500mg test an 12 iu gh.
Dr_jitsu
Senior Member
- Apr 21, 2013
- 222
- 16
I am not an expert on GH, that is for sure. I am very good w/ contest prep, however.
What went on before the avi pic? Was that just an unprepped pic, or is it a contest ready shot?
Wer you running diuretics? Did you deplete and load?
I am not a fan of depleting and loading....I did it 6 times and it worked once. What I recommend is getting you completely shredded and a bit overdieted at the 10 day out mark.
We would then gradually raise your carbohydrates over a 10 day perieod, closely monitoring your look. Every thing else is diuretics. Yes they can be dangerous...people keep pushing he limits. Don't do that, stick with the formula. Aldosterne blocker 25 mgs to 100 over 4 days, intro a Thiazide and gradually titrate. Do not touch lasix until night of the show. It can kill you, and worse make you look flat.
Drink plenty of water up to 6 pm day before show.
What went on before the avi pic? Was that just an unprepped pic, or is it a contest ready shot?
Wer you running diuretics? Did you deplete and load?
I am not a fan of depleting and loading....I did it 6 times and it worked once. What I recommend is getting you completely shredded and a bit overdieted at the 10 day out mark.
We would then gradually raise your carbohydrates over a 10 day perieod, closely monitoring your look. Every thing else is diuretics. Yes they can be dangerous...people keep pushing he limits. Don't do that, stick with the formula. Aldosterne blocker 25 mgs to 100 over 4 days, intro a Thiazide and gradually titrate. Do not touch lasix until night of the show. It can kill you, and worse make you look flat.
Drink plenty of water up to 6 pm day before show.
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