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Aerial Photo Shows 9/11 Towers Exploded Out, Did Not Collapse Down

HGH

HGH

MuscleHead
Jan 11, 2013
1,215
185
Wood is not stronger than steel in a fire because it catches. It becomes part of the fuel. Are you really an architect?

You are correct that steel weakens and bends when subjected to very hot, long-burning fires. No one ever said that it didn't.

Wrong.

Wood will eventually catch fire and burn. HOWEVER, a similarly-sized steel member will melt and lose its structural integrity in LESS TIME than it takes for the wood member to burn and collapse. The amount of time it takes in a hot fire for steel to melt is VERY SHORT. About an hour as it turns out. The other building you mentioned didn't collapse because the steel's fire-proofing remained in tact and wasn't blown off by the impact of a 747.

If the twin towers' fireproofing had remained in tact they wouldn't have collapsed either.

It is cut and dried.

Feel free to contact my old structures professor if you still don't get it:

[email protected]

:rofl:
 
Braw16

Braw16

MuscleHead
Aug 8, 2012
719
53
Saw that but at the time of construction there was no airliners as big as the ones that hit them and they say that.
 
Lizard King

Lizard King

Administrator
Staff Member
Sep 9, 2010
14,551
8,028
And 10,000 gallons of anything is nothing compared to a 96,000 tons of steel frame. That is a weight ration of 3-to-10,000.

Can you please break that down to a ratio that makes sense. Gallons of something flammable to the weight ration of a building is not a comparable item. Break down the amount of energy released by the jet fuel along with the square footage of the area it hit along with the melting point with that area of steel and come back and post, please no copy and paste as I would like to see your long math on this.
Thank You
 
P

prime

TID Board Of Directors
Dec 31, 2011
1,178
254
Wrong.

Wood will eventually catch fire and burn. HOWEVER, a similarly-sized steel member will melt and lose its structural integrity in LESS TIME than it takes for the wood member to burn and collapse. The amount of time it takes in a hot fire for steel to melt is VERY SHORT. About an hour as it turns out. The other building you mentioned didn't collapse because the steel's fire-proofing remained in tact and wasn't blown off by the impact of a 747.

If the twin towers' fireproofing had remained in tact they wouldn't have collapsed either.

It is cut and dried.

Feel free to contact my old structures professor if you still don't get it:

[email protected]

:rofl:

Are you saying a 2x4 piece of wood is structurally stronger than a 2x4 piece of steel in a fire? You are saying the steel will fail before the wood? I'm having a very hard time believing this considering the 2x4 steel beam would be able to hold 100x+ the load of a piece of wood of similar size.

I can believe similar load bearing equivalents of each perhaps.
 
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69nites

69nites

VIP Member
Aug 17, 2011
2,132
725
Are you saying a 2x4 piece of wood is structurally stronger than a 2x4 piece of steel in a fire? You are saying the steel will fail before the wood? I'm having a very hard time believing this considering the 2x4 steel beam would be able to hold 100x+ the load of a piece of wood of similar size.

I can believe similar load bearing equivalents of each perhaps.

He's not entirely wrong. For a few seconds when the structural steel has reached its malleable temp and the wood has yet to burn through the wood would be stronger.

The problem with that line of thinking is that he's focusing on a 30 second window. Not the part where the impact of the plane would have instantly destroyed the entire framing of the building on impact.

WTC were in fact designed to be able to withstand the impact of a plane. Just like the Titanic was designed to withstand icebergs. In the case of serous extremes there's just nothing you can do.
 
Rein

Rein

MuscleHead
Sep 10, 2010
1,241
128
Okay, lets say for just a second that the towers did blow apart. Why would you think the gov. did this? And not the Islamic extremists that smashed planes into the towers? Maybe the bombing of the world trade center in 93 was a test of the structure. If those crazies could bring in bombs into the parking garage and blow them up, why would it be not be a possibility they did this again expect all throughout the building, and then used the planes and Jet fuel to weaken the structure?

Do you remember the bombing attacks in the subways of England? Then comes 9/11. The purpose is to convince the masses through the media that everyone who is not American or doesn't agree with their acts is an enemy/terrorist, especially if he is from the middle east. The perfect excuse to start a war with them. Again, this is happening because they desperately need oil. They have built the world around it and made it oil dependant. Almost everything is made out of it.

I am not a communist or a religious fanatic but what all these people want is to be left alone. They have been in war for decades and no one is letting them advance to something supperior than they are. Same goes with Africa. I honestly don't mean to offend anyone but it's no coincidence that most people AND nations globablly hate American politicians and call THEM terrorists. They have INVADED in almost every country in the world and stick their noses everywhere in order to "bring peace". (Peace coming from the sky with drones).

Invasion does not only happen with weapons and war. It also happens in the form of financial war. As long as they can buy anything they can also byuy corrupted politicians and parties to do their dirty job. They have seperated the world in four Unions so that it can be more easily controlled. Now they want totall globalization, a New World Order or One World Government as politicians call it and they will do anything they can in order to succeed. All that matters is to unite the world through a common religion, government and global system. I don't see anything wrong with that but it's not something you try after global population has reached 7 billion. It's plain common sense that people wll react because their rights and well-being is threatened by some "elit" power-freaks. They don't care about human lives. You, me, everyone is just a slave to their system.

I am not trying to convince anyone, I am merely trying to show you the other side of the coin. I am talking about facts that no one can doubt because there is ton of proof out there but guess what, believing in lies is always easier than accepting bone-crushing truth.

The only way out of this is nationalism but oh, I forgot, nationalism is AGAINST the global communist dictatorship they are trying to built.

PS: And for all you who bash the various videos on youtube, are you trying to tell me that the mass media is more beliavable? If yes then I feel sorry for you.

598749_622516307775181_930257313_n_zps5da3839b.jpg
 
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HGH

HGH

MuscleHead
Jan 11, 2013
1,215
185
Are you saying a 2x4 piece of wood is structurally stronger than a 2x4 piece of steel in a fire? You are saying the steel will fail before the wood? I'm having a very hard time believing this considering the 2x4 steel beam would be able to hold 100x+ the load of a piece of wood of similar size.

I can believe similar load bearing equivalents of each perhaps.

Listen carefully:

In an equivalent fire the 2x4 stud will burn through and collapse. A 2x4 steel stud will begin to melt. It will take less time to melt the steel than to burn through the wood.

This:

cedar-2x4.jpg


lasts longer than this:

Metal-Stud-and-Track.jpg


(since you called out stud sizes not beam sizes)

Wood stays rigid as it burns. Steel does not stay rigid under heat.
 
P

prime

TID Board Of Directors
Dec 31, 2011
1,178
254
I was actually trying to use a dimemsion but I can see how in construction it would be different. I was trying to get clarification because it seemed to me that a solid piece of steel the exact same dimensions as a solid piece of wood would have way more rigidity and load capacity but I get that they would load it up more stresses and under heat the piece would deform.
 
HGH

HGH

MuscleHead
Jan 11, 2013
1,215
185
I was actually trying to use a dimemsion but I can see how in construction it would be different. I was trying to get clarification because it seemed to me that a solid piece of steel the exact same dimensions as a solid piece of wood would have way more rigidity and load capacity but I get that they would load it up more stresses and under heat the piece would deform.

Yeah you will never have a solid chunk of steel. Always a C-shape or I-shape or L-shape etc. The similarly-sized wood member would be solid.
 
S

southernhound

Member
Mar 3, 2013
63
2
Can you please break that down to a ratio that makes sense. Gallons of something flammable to the weight ration of a building is not a comparable item. Break down the amount of energy released by the jet fuel along with the square footage of the area it hit along with the melting point with that area of steel and come back and post, please no copy and paste as I would like to see your long math on this.
Thank You

This is a good question. Even rough calculations of heat content of the fuels versus the amount of steel show nowhere near the amount of fuel required to soften that much steel. If the official story is true then it revolutionizes the foundry business, which spends lots of money on blast furnaces which burns lots of expensive coal or coke (refined coal) in an enclosed ceramic chamber, into which pre-heated air is "blasted" through the fuel to raise steel to 5,000F to melt, and maybe 4,000F to make malleable enough to work.

The fires in the towers never reached higher than a little under 500F according to NIST's own report, which is the temperature of normal office fires. This is backed up by the firefighters' radio transmission that they were looking at "isolated pockets" of fire that they could "knock down" (put out) with "two lines" (hoses.)


10,000 gallons of kerosene (jet fuel) has a maximum heat content of about 1.3 billion BTUs (One gallon contains 135,000 BTUs x 10,000 gallons)

http://www.hrt.msu.edu/Energy/pdf/Heating Value of Common Fuels.pdf

Carbon steel has a specific heat of .12 BTU/lb. That means it requires .12 BTU of energy to raise one pound of it by one degree F.

Specific heats:
http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/specific-heat-metals-d_152.html

So lets say you wanted know how many BTU it would take to raise the temperature of just the steel in the upper 15 floors, above the points of impact, to say, 2,000F. That is still far short of 5,000F at which steel melts, and this is neglecting that since steel is an excellent heat conductor, the steel frame would conduct the heat energy throughout the frame. All of it could not just stay on 15 floors.

Since the steel frame is about 96,000 tons of steel, including core columns, and load-bearing perimeter columns, 15 floors would contain roughly 15/110 x 96,000 tons = 13,000 tons

In order to raise the temperature of 13,000 tons of steel by 2,000 degrees, it would require:

.12 BTU/lb x 13,000 tons x 2,000 lbs/ton x 2,000 degrees = 6.2 billion BTU


Again, since kerosene contains 135,000 BTU/gallon and there were maximum 10,000 gallons (half loaded) in each plane, the kerosene (jet fuel) could only produce 1.3 billion BTU under the most favorable conditions. 6.2 billion is greater than 1.3 billion. It's not even in the ballpark.

We are assuming that not one drop of it blew out in the fireballs, that it all stayed in the building, and that it burned at maximum efficiency in an optimum fuel-air mixture, which was not true. Kerosene only burned this efficiently in a jet engine, where the fuel is made into aerosol, compressed, and ignited in an oxygen rich mixture. In open air fires much of it is lost in soot and carbon by-products, called a "dirty" burn.

All that is back of the envelope stuff. A more extensive set of heat calculations by a professor of physics is here: http://www.journalof911studies.com/volume/200704/ProfMorroneOnMeltingWTCsteel.pdf

These are all good questions but still beside the point. We know fire can melt steel or make it soft. That why there have been partial collapses in high-rises and why fireproofing is used, to inhibit these partial collapses. What makes the official story ultimately impossible is that, even if the steel did get soft and bend, the mass could not have accelerated to the ground at the same speed it would fall through thin air. Steel is denser than air, even soft steel.

The lower 90 stories would have absorbed energy and slowed it, not added to it and increased it. Mass does not go faster as it accumulates/gets heavier. This is what Galileo proved.

We also know that the towers were specifically designed to take multiple hits from planes the size of 767s. The largest plane flying at the time of design was the 707. From the design engineers' parameters here: http://911research.wtc7.net/wtc/analysis/design.html

aircraftcomparison.gif


property Boeing 707-320 Boeing 767-200
fuel capacity 23,000 gallons 23,980 gallons
max takeoff weight 328,060 lbs 395,000 lbs
empty weight 137,562 lbs 179,080 lbs
wingspan 145.75 ft 156.08 ft
wing area 3010 ft^2 3050 ft^2
length 152.92 ft 159.17 ft
cruise speed 607 mph 530 mph


A 9/11 Story Problem: Which 15 story building hits the ground first?
ae911truth.38c_small.jpg

http://www.naderlibrary.com/911.blueprintfortruthae3.htm

Answer: On 9/11 both upper blocks hit the ground at virtually the same time, suspending the laws of physics!

-If the 15 story section is falling at free fall speed ...

-All of its gravitational potential energy is converted to Kinetic Energy (movement)

- It is not available to do the work of "crushing" the building below!

- It would have to slow down in order to do any other work, i.e., "crushing 80,000 tons of structural steel below.

As a side note everyone should know that it is 9/11 families themselves who are asking for a new investigation. This is an ad running on NYC cable television. Are they all tin foil and crazy?





See: 9/11 Science Club: Mass Does Not Accelerate as it Accumulates

explanation of specific heat:
http://schools.wikia.com/wiki/Specific_Heat
 
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P

prime

TID Board Of Directors
Dec 31, 2011
1,178
254
I remember watching them fall at the time and thought to myself why do they pay demolition companies millions of dollars to bring buildings straight down when these buildings seem to pancake on their own. We're told over and over prior to this that these demolitions are the only way to have a building pancake.

The other question is why have it pancake at all? If you are killing 3000 people why not just topple it where ever it may fall?
 
J

johnjay06

VIP Member
Jul 22, 2011
426
87
Wow, just wow is all I can say. I honestly didn't think these types of people really existed.
 
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