Excited to be here...cycle advice?

[shan]

I water and sodium load but didn't worry about potassium...just ate and drank lol

 

[Dr_jitsu]

If you are going to use diuretics, you need to know what you are doing. If so, then you don't need to carb deplete/load, stop drinking water etc. This is the formula for a 200 lb man at 4% bodyfat, so adjust accordingly.

The program takes 10 days. I got it from an IFBB pro, back before diuretics were banned. Competitors kept pushing the envelope (Germans ran diuretics for 30 days). It you stick to the formula you will be fine, as everything is designed to go together. You cannot miss any pieces of the puzzle.

10 days out: Aldosterone blocker, 25 mgs titrated up to 100 ed (remember, 200 lb man at 4% bf, so adjust accordingly). Then, introduce a thiazide, again titrating up from 25 mgs to 100. Stay there for last 2 days. Cut sodium Thursday night Fr morning, but keep drinking water up to friday night. The night before the show, use a half tab of lasics DO NOT USE LASICS W/ OUT TE REST OF THE FORMULA BEING IN PLACE, IT WILL RUIN YOU, OR WORSE!! Depending on how you look, take another at bedtime, and morning of show.

Lasics depletes potassium, but Spirinolactone (aldosterone blocker) is potassium sparing, so no loading of potass. is neded, in fact it can kill you. Just take a balanced multi vit/ mineral.

 

[TenaciousA]

Dr J---appreciate the advice. I don't want to cause any parameter of renal or cardiac function to become compromised so I'll keep things on task and will NOT run anything higher than doses for hypertension.

If that.

May not use at all.

 

[Dr_jitsu]

Dr J---appreciate the advice. I don't want to cause any parameter of renal or cardiac function to become compromised so I'll keep things on task and will NOT run anything higher than doses for hypertension.

If that.

May not use at all.

Probably a good choice. Diuretics can be VERY dangerous.

 

[Dr_jitsu]

you have 20 weeks so i would cycle off the EQ and start a Var cycle 10mg up to 25mg depending on how your sides go. EQ is a cutter so i would stay on the Var till 12 weeks cut the var then add in the EQ again. If your var cycle went good then at 10-8 weeks add in the var and see how that goes " sides" cut the var 4 weeks out do to water retention cont the EQ. start your clen 12 weeks out 2 weeks on 2 off. Nolva 4 weeks out 10mg 2 weeks then 20mg 2 weeks. night be4 show if u need to drop water try to get your hands on aldactone. You don't have to worry about for potassium but watch your water consumption when you start a diuretic if will make you hold water if you consume to much while on it. I would try Expel 5 days out and see how that goes before jumping on the diuretic.

Funny story, I am like tight in regards to cycles (as are top level BB's). Cycles look crazy, but work. Over at MESO forum, I would get ridiculed for my crazy cycles, but remember, these are people who never set foot on a stage. I was told that running deca for 6 weeks and then switching to EQ would be a "waste" since I did not give the deca a long enough run. I am stacking test, and var (and just added Mast). Well, I am close to the switch, up 14 lbs w/ defined abs etc.

 

[tightglutes]

Funny story, I am like tight in regards to cycles (as are top level BB's). Cycles look crazy, but work. Over at MESO forum, I would get ridiculed for my crazy cycles, but remember, these are people who never set foot on a stage. I was told that running deca for 6 weeks and then switching to EQ would be a "waste" since I did not give the deca a long enough run. I am stacking test, and var (and just added Mast). Well, I am close to the switch, up 14 lbs w/ defined abs etc.

It does not look to crazy LOL I'm doing it only with primo

 

[TenaciousA]

Cycle Decisions....
I am 16 weeks out, starting cardio daily x6d (30m lift days 60m otheewise) with heavy lifts 5 days.

Carb cycling with calorie goal for now 1600 training 1400 off, have to see how I respond. Want 200g protein a day an split the rest appropriately.

1. Test p 5 mg qod as TRT---started Monday.
2. Var 12.5 mg bid x8 weeks.
3. GH 1iu qd (MUST get rid of nagging injuries).
4. T4 qd for GH.
5. Eq 125 mg qd add back at week 8.
6. ****I have winny 50 mg tabs, not sure if when to use****
7. Hopefully nolva per Glutes suggestions: 10 mg qd weeks 13,14. 20mg qd x weeks 15,16.
8. Clen---unsure if I'll get it but hopeful.

Keep yinz guys posted....

Also, I am NOT making serious strength gains with var (have been on for 4 weeks consistently). I realize that everyone responds differently, but at 25 mg a day I was kind of hoping to see some size or strength game – I'm seeing fat loss but no size and strength?

Curious for thoughts.

 

[tightglutes]

At 25mg you should be seeing something. maybe your source is not 100% i have gotten fake var in the past but i think it was D-bol. Nolva will make you pee like a bitch lol love it . the EQ is a good cutter so you might not need the winny and if you have injuries i would not suggest it. good luck

 

[Dr_jitsu]

Cycle Decisions....
I am 16 weeks out, starting cardio daily x6d (30m lift days 60m otheewise) with heavy lifts 5 days.

Carb cycling with calorie goal for now 1600 training 1400 off, have to see how I respond. Want 200g protein a day an split the rest appropriately.

1. Test p 5 mg qod as TRT---started Monday.
2. Var 12.5 mg bid x8 weeks.
3. GH 1iu qd (MUST get rid of nagging injuries).
4. T4 qd for GH.
5. Eq 125 mg qd add back at week 8.
6. ****I have winny 50 mg tabs, not sure if when to use****
7. Hopefully nolva per Glutes suggestions: 10 mg qd weeks 13,14. 20mg qd x weeks 15,16.
8. Clen---unsure if I'll get it but hopeful.

Keep yinz guys posted....

Also, I am NOT making serious strength gains with var (have been on for 4 weeks consistently). I realize that everyone responds differently, but at 25 mg a day I was kind of hoping to see some size or strength game – I'm seeing fat loss but no size and strength?

Curious for thoughts.

There is a LOT of fake var out there, usually winstrol. The raws from China cost 9 times more for var, so ugl's buy the winney, and pass it off as var. However, you should still see gains from winney.

As others mentioned, and I concur, you are doing too much gear. I would get rid of the test altogether, are you using a topical like Androgel? EQ is a great choice, but I would only run 50 mgs e5d. Nolvadex is a great prep compound, will harden up the legs. Be careful, however because it also has virulizing sides. I would run 10 mgs ed, and titrate up last 2 weeks. Run clen, absolutely, I recommend running t3 w/ clen as the t3 makes the clen more effective. Again, be careful w/ the t3, always titrate up, and more importantly down, unless you don't like your hair and thyroid. There used to be a formula (Dan Duchains") to determine effectiveness of clen. Its done via tracking body temp. If I get time I will look for it. I did 20 a day and absolutely hated it, but it worked.

 

[TenaciousA]

First of all, thank you to everyone who's offered me advice as this is my first go around.

I'm going to restart the Q had Alemedo's in about eight weeks, I'm just wondering though Dr J why you suggested every five days? Half-life of the drug would indicate that you can almost as it every 10 days---This is my pharmacokinetic brain talking, not my actual experience driven brain talking.

As I mentioned previously, I realize that AAS Are not going to make me a monster overnight, if ever. My curiosity lies in the fact that I taken EQ for five weeks, and realized it is a very slow kicker, and bar at 25 mg a day and I've already done one cycle of six weeks. I actually have not seen, as noted, increases in size or strength – it's made fat loss more apparent for sure, but Hasn't added, in my opinion, even slightly minimal hypertrophy or strength gains.

I realize that I may not be consuming enough calories? So I have to reevaluate my diet and cardio---which trust me I'm not doing a lot of--and see if this could be the source of the problem.

The only reason I was adding the test is I'm attempting to gain some size and my legs; the matter how hard I beat the shit out of them and how much I can't walk the next day, there's still suck in the same holding pattern. I do not wish to have any virilization, so I can drop the test. Again, I realize that nothing is a magic bullet accept hard work in time, but at this point I threw up my hands – which got me into considering steroids in the first place – because of the fact that pound my legs a weekly basis to no avail. I realize it's probably genetic, as my father is in the same boat, but I really can't explain that to the judges.

I suppose my regimen will look at such then:
1. For now, var 12 1/2 twice today.
2.GH times two more weeks, as that will be a four week cycle will consider taking off another four weeks and then restarting and four or six weeks is necessary.
3. T3? I'm sure if I need to leave that I'm without the GH.
4. Restart EQ in eight weeks.
5. ? Clen and nolva if able to acquire.

I have 16 weeks starting on Saturday, my diet has been almost squeaky clean for the past three months and I have dropped a significant amount of body fat, my only concern is that at this point I'm going to peak too early. I'll have to just keep an eye on my diet and cardio---Really aiming to see a lot of shredded muscle, so going to have to do a lot of speed work.

Sincerely thank you all for your input, I will definitely keep you posted.

 

[shan]

peaking early is not necessarily a bad thing, if you can just maintain focus and caost in there I have a friend in the same boat, trying desperately to add size to her legs but just hasn't found the right formula yet (and that is despite alot ALOT of gear LOL). Genetics does play a big role I am afraid, but having well developed and shredded legs goes a long way even if they aren't huge...go for the conditioning at this point.

 

[sassy69]

Cycle Decisions....
I am 16 weeks out, starting cardio daily x6d (30m lift days 60m otheewise) with heavy lifts 5 days.

Carb cycling with calorie goal for now 1600 training 1400 off, have to see how I respond. Want 200g protein a day an split the rest appropriately.

1. Test p 5 mg qod as TRT---started Monday.
2. Var 12.5 mg bid x8 weeks.
3. GH 1iu qd (MUST get rid of nagging injuries).
4. T4 qd for GH.
5. Eq 125 mg qd add back at week 8.
6. ****I have winny 50 mg tabs, not sure if when to use****
7. Hopefully nolva per Glutes suggestions: 10 mg qd weeks 13,14. 20mg qd x weeks 15,16.
8. Clen---unsure if I'll get it but hopeful.

Keep yinz guys posted....

Also, I am NOT making serious strength gains with var (have been on for 4 weeks consistently). I realize that everyone responds differently, but at 25 mg a day I was kind of hoping to see some size or strength game – I'm seeing fat loss but no size and strength?

Curious for thoughts.

A rule of thumb for you and anyone else reading this- if you find yourself spending a lot of time talking more about how much/ how many drugs you're using than the rest of your prep, and you don't like your results, that's an awesome red flag to remind you that you need to revisit your foundation. The drugs are ALWAYS only supplements to your foundation protocol (diet, training, recovery). Adding in more or different drugs ain't the fix you need to spend time on.

My first check before I go into "my analysis results", I don't know your stats. I quickly scanned your log but didn't see them. I'll include my stats for now to give you a relative idea of where I'd expect things to be.

If I read above correctly, you are carb cycling, with a total 1600 cals on your "high carb" days and 1400 on the "low" days? When I prep, I find I really need to keep my cals around 1750-1800/day to function and retain results. I'm 5'7 & typically compete (in BB) at 148-150 (with 30 yrs of muscle maturity). Also when I carb cycle, I keep my total cals constant but adjust the macros - e.g. on a high carb day, I drop fats, on a low carb day, I replace difference in carb cals w/ fat cals. Given the intensity of training you're doing, I think its more important to keep the cals so your body doesn't stall. The idea is to find optimal metabolism, not force your body to slow metabolism because it isn't getting enough to support the energy demands.

I also think you're doing overkill if you're doing an hour of cardio at 16 weeks out. If you want to have cardio as one of your variables to tweak as you dial in, where are you going to go from 1 hour over the next 4 months? Personally I think 30 min / day is plenty right now. You didn't indicate the type of cardio you're doing but if you're doing steadystate, you might consider alternating w/ HIIT, e.g. on your no training days.

I also don't know why you're doing doing on / off w/ the gh?

The primary point I'm making w/ all of the above is that I think you're looking to the drugs to do the work. IMO you're not eating enough this far out and you're doing too much cardio. So basically your legs aren't growing because you aren't eating for growth and all the cardio is making it catabolic to boot. And you are going to be very limited in how much you can increase if you're already on a pretty limited cal intake & an hour of cardio at 4 months out. That isn't really sustainable as you get closer to show time and want to have things to tweak to continue prompting your body to respond as it adapts to the current protocol. By 4 weeks out you may find yourself eating 800 cals / day & doing 3 hrs of cardio - all you're going to be is starved & exhausted and your body isn't going to be running optimally. The drugs are not going to be able to compensate for all of that.