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Second Cycle Planning Begins

PillarofBalance

PillarofBalance

Strength Pimp
Feb 27, 2011
17,066
4,635
#25
So the decision I had made was to run Test Prop/Tren Ace/Winni for 8 weeks. Prior to this, I'm cutting like crazy on a CKD for a couple months while I wrap up PCT. So I should harden up pretty nice.

But here is my question:

I want to go from this cycle straight into one consisting of test cypionate and bold cypionate for 12 weeks and then into PCT. So I'm thinking this.

Cycle1A
Weeks 1-6
Test Prop 60mg ED
Tren Ace 50mg ED
Winni caps 50mg ED

Weeks 7 and 8
Test Prop 60mg ED
Tren Ace 50mg ED

Cycle 1B

Weeks 9 and 10
Test Prop 60mg ED
Test Cyp 250mg M and Th

Weeks 11-22
Test Cyp 250mg M and Th
Bold Cyp 150mg M and Th

Any concerns with how I'm transitioning there? The cyp takes 4 to 5 weeks to peak, so I'm wondering if maybe the prop needs to go another couple weeks or if the active life of the prop might carry along...
 
Last edited:
Ogre717

Ogre717

TID Official Lab Rat
Jul 22, 2011
1,291
242
#26
Thats an awfully complicated second cycle. if your just looking to lean out and harden up why not just run test front loaded or sust with var or winny? you seem to be over complicating things early in the game
 
Rein

Rein

MuscleHead
Sep 10, 2010
1,241
128
#27
I would run the Bold Cyp for a good 10 weeks along with the test cyp and then switch to the short esters and winnie. Also I would inject short esters eod but that's just me.

I don't really see a reason though to cycle for such a long time since this is your second cycle and I certainly don't see why you want to use tren on your second cycle.

Leave some free play for later cycles bro!
 
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MuscleHead
Sep 9, 2010
3,442
644
#28
It looks like you're trying to run a cutter before a bulker, which doesn't make a ton of sense to me. And personally, starting with prop and ending with Cyp makes even less sense, lol. What is your main goal for the cycle? I'll show you how I wodl structure it in the next post....
 
PillarofBalance

PillarofBalance

Strength Pimp
Feb 27, 2011
17,066
4,635
#30
My thoughts on running it this way was the first cycle is about strength training in the 3-5 rep range, then on the longer esters I would increase the cals and rep range to build up the mass.

Ogre I'm not so sure it is complicated, except for the few weeks where I'm pinning two test esters. Two injectables and an oral does't seem any different to me than a sust/winni cycle.

Thanks Rein, I appreciate your thoughts on using the tren in this cycle. It's on hand and I've been planning this for a couple months and I'm sure I have an understanding of the powers/sides of the compound. But I understand what you're saying bro.
 
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MuscleHead
Sep 9, 2010
3,442
644
#31
Test Cyp 500mg EW Weeks 1-12
Bold Cyp 450mg EW Weeks 1-12
Test Prop 200mg EW Weeks 1-4
Test Prop 300mg EW Weeks 13-16
Tren Ace 300mg EW Weeks 13-16
Winny 50-75mg ED Weeks 13-16

This way you end with the short esters and only have to wait days or a week to start PCT. You could start with another oral like tbol for the first 4 weeks but adding in 2 prop pins should be jsut as easy and easier on your liver.

Also, I would not recommend that you pin tren or prop ED. Tren maybe, but not prop. If you pin prop everyday, you have no chance of reaching the levels that you could by pinning EOD because a larger volume injection less frequently will always hit a higher peak than a lower volume injection more frequently. "Consistent levels" are really overstated unless you're talking about tren or injecting once every 2 weeks, lol. When I run short esters I only pin them 3x weekly (M,W,F) and it works out great. With the prop in the beginning even just 2 100mg injections weekly will suffice. For the Tren I would still recommend at most EOD, but you can try ED if you want. The problem is running out of fresh injection sites and building up scar tissue. If you dont' already, you need to switch to using 25g needles to save yourself some scar tissue.

Let me know if you have any questions.
 
PillarofBalance

PillarofBalance

Strength Pimp
Feb 27, 2011
17,066
4,635
#32
Test Cyp 500mg EW Weeks 1-12
Bold Cyp 450mg EW Weeks 1-12
Test Prop 200mg EW Weeks 1-4
Test Prop 300mg EW Weeks 13-16
Tren Ace 300mg EW Weeks 13-16
Winny 50-75mg ED Weeks 13-16

This way you end with the short esters and only have to wait days or a week to start PCT. You could start with another oral like tbol for the first 4 weeks but adding in 2 prop pins should be jsut as easy and easier on your liver.

Also, I would not recommend that you pin tren or prop ED. Tren maybe, but not prop. If you pin prop everyday, you have no chance of reaching the levels that you could by pinning EOD because a larger volume injection less frequently will always hit a higher peak than a lower volume injection more frequently. "Consistent levels" are really overstated unless you're talking about tren or injecting once every 2 weeks, lol. When I run short esters I only pin them 3x weekly (M,W,F) and it works out great. With the prop in the beginning even just 2 100mg injections weekly will suffice. For the Tren I would still recommend at most EOD, but you can try ED if you want. The problem is running out of fresh injection sites and building up scar tissue. If you dont' already, you need to switch to using 25g needles to save yourself some scar tissue.

Let me know if you have any questions.
Holy shit I had some serious misconceptions about injection frequency. I had the info on peak levels exactly backwards...

I do have 25g pins and I am also nuts about ischemic compression, foam rolling, deep tissue work etc for breaking up scar tissue from injections or even just lifting.

Thanks as always GS.
 

SHINE

Friends Remembered
Oct 11, 2010
5,047
601
#33
LOL! you guys are way over thinking this I think!

Like what GS posted though and oughta do it.
 
69nites

69nites

MuscleHead
Aug 17, 2011
1,988
568
#34
why not run test Helios var and t3.

var will blow up your strength Helios and t3 combined with fasted am cardio will cut the fat.

it's a pretty simple cycle with low sides and results.
 
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MuscleHead
Sep 9, 2010
3,442
644
#35
why not run test Helios var and t3.

var will blow up your strength Helios and t3 combined with fasted am cardio will cut the fat.

it's a pretty simple cycle with low sides and results.
I think he is looking for some bulk as well, hence the first 12 weeks of test and boldenone I had laid out for him. But yes, what you suggested is a very simple and effective cutter. You don't even need that much test for an effective cutter, just 200-300mg EW.
 
PillarofBalance

PillarofBalance

Strength Pimp
Feb 27, 2011
17,066
4,635
#36
Not sure if I want to play with the t3 yet bro but I appreciate the suggestion.
 
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