Keto Diet Question

[PillarofBalance]

I'm trying to plan my calories for the friday/saturday carb fiesta and I'm getting hung up.

My maintenance cals are 3300. But I want to be at 2800 during the week for fat loss. But during the weekend It's suggested I eat 12 grams per kilogram of bodyweight (80kg). Thats 960 grams of carbs... That's 3840 calories just on carbs alone!!!

Can someone suggest a ratio that I can use to calculate my macros for carb up days while on CKD????

 

[IronInsanity]

Textbook CKD goes 65% fat, 30% pro and 5% carb through the week, then flip the fat and carbs on the carb-up window (e.g., Friday 6pm through midnight Saturday)... so 65% carbs. For me, and I've done this about 4 times for 2-3 months at a time, I just eat whatever I want on my carb-up window... anything and everything. Do not track at all during the carb-up. Always worked well for me. I just went back on a couple days ago and I'm already fantasizing about pizza on Friday night.

But to answer your question: if you want to stick to 2800 cals, make them 65% carbs, i.e., 455g during your carb-up.

 

[Wolf]

I've done it two ways. The first way is going as high as I felt was appropriate the second way was a bit more structured, the first 24 hours being a split between 70% carbs, 15/15 fat and protein and the second 24 hours was 60% carbs, 25% protein and 15% fat. This is from Lyle McDonalds work.


At about 180 pounds of lean body mass you can expect to eat close to 4.5k to 5k calories even on a 24 hour carb up./

 

[PillarofBalance]

So if I am trying to seriously loose a significant amount of fat, should I leave the cals at the 2800 or is it cool to jack them up on the carb days? Instinct tells me to keep em low to avoid spillover and doing the two steps forward one step back thing.

 

[NutNut]

I've seen it done both ways but I like to keep carb ups aka cheats in a controlled state. Extra energy (or potential energy) has to go somewhere and it isn't like cheat meals give some huge boost in metabolism to account for giant overages. Do remember though we are not calorimeters, foods are not broken down the same in the human body as they are when tested in the lab. Your food choices do matter not just the cals you consume.

 

[IronInsanity]

So if I am trying to seriously loose a significant amount of fat, should I leave the cals at the 2800 or is it cool to jack them up on the carb days? Instinct tells me to keep em low to avoid spillover and doing the two steps forward one step back thing.

Brother, stuff your face until it hurts. Serious.

 

[Halo]

Great thread!!!

 

[Wolf]

I wouldn't worry about it too much. You will get some upregulating of your metabolism from the increased intake, then any fat turn over would have to come after the glycogen stores, which are close to depleted are refilled and after your metabolism is surpassed. So you are looking at a situation where high over feeding will not contribute that much fat overspill. Even your glycogen stores can be supercompensated, so they could potentially be filled some measure above what they normally are.

 

[PillarofBalance]

Thanks for the help guys... Alright so here goes my attempt at a 65/30/5 meal plan

Sunday - Friday afternoon

Meal 1 35fat/34p
5 eggs + one egg white

Meal 2,3,4 37/30
4ounces 85% ground beef 16/30
1.5TB olive or flax oil 21/0

Meal 5 44/39.5
1.5 scoops isopure 0/37.5
1/2 cup heavy cream 44/2

Meal 6 34/39
6 of my favorite breakfast sausage links 34/14
1 scoop isopure 0/25

There will be a bonus 25grams of isopure protein after meal two. This is my post workout shake.

FRIDAY-SATURDAY CARB UP

Friday pre workout will have a couple fruits like a pear or apples. Post workout shake will include 100grams of quick digesting liquid carbs (lee labrada power carb).

Meals will look like this:
9 egg whites 0/0/36
40 carbs of some kind of cereal 40/0/0
1 cup fat free milk 12/0/8

3/4 cup brown rice 33.7c/0f/5p
4oz chicken breast 0/4/36

Let me know if you guys see any flaws. Otherwise I am quite looking forward to this!!!!

 

[IronInsanity]

Some stuff that'll help ya after a while...

Cashews!
Spoonful of PB
Low Carb tortilla wraps
Pork Rinds
Any fastfood burger w/o bun
Dressing! For me... Bacon Ranch
If you look hard, you can find some low carb protein bars

 

[NutNut]

I wouldn't worry about it too much. You will get some upregulating of your metabolism from the increased intake, then any fat turn over would have to come after the glycogen stores, which are close to depleted are refilled and after your metabolism is surpassed. So you are looking at a situation where high over feeding will not contribute that much fat overspill. Even your glycogen stores can be supercompensated, so they could potentially be filled some measure above what they normally are.

As Martin Berkhan once explained:

Studies on overfeeding shows that metabolic rate typically increases about 6-8% for up to 24 hours after feeding. There's also large differences in between individuals, illustrated by the fact that the magnitude of the increase ranges from 3-10%. Those prone to obesity ("thrifty" phenotypes) tend to be in the lower range (3%), while the naturally lean ("spendthrifty" phenotype) tend to be in the upper range (10%). Either way, from a fat loss perspective it's not really justified to eat thousands of surplus calories to burn a few hundred calories extra.

Those glycogen stores don't take that much to fill hence my point about managing your cheat. Lyle McDonald has the figures in his keto book but this covers it well enough: How Many Carbohydrates Do You Need | BodyRecomposition - The Home of Lyle McDonald Now I don't know about you but on a cheat I could blow by 7-8g per pound of LBM easy.

 

[PillarofBalance]

Some stuff that'll help ya after a while...

Cashews!
Spoonful of PB
Low Carb tortilla wraps
Pork Rinds
Any fastfood burger w/o bun
Dressing! For me... Bacon Ranch
If you look hard, you can find some low carb protein bars

I keep a jar of PB behind some glass just in case. My nutrition shop has a great selection of bars too I will check that out. I also have a great recipe for pork rind pancakes

I wasn't sure how nuts fit in to this as they do contain carbs....