Bye bye twinkies!!!

[MorganKane]

Here is the information that you used from huffingtonpost that suggests Driscoll received a huge pay raise...

Some creditors question Hostess pay raises approved in late July.

Brian Driscoll, CEO, around $750,000 to $2,550,000.
Gary Wandschneider, EVP, $500,000 to $900,000.
John Stewart, EVP, $400,000 to $700,000.
David Loeser, EVP, $375,000 to $656,256.


The problem I have with Driscoll's pay raise in July is the fact that he resigned in March.

Posted: 11:11 PM, March 9, 2012

Hostess CEO Brian Driscoll abruptly resigned yesterday, fueling speculation from company insiders that the bankrupt baker might be weighing liquidation

http://www.nypost.com/p/news/business/humble_pie_at_hostess_vEahL6ZJbXfJreTbKpVDVP


Don't believe all the propaganda you read.

I dont think people really get the pay structure change.
its not that they just got a raise but they got their pay structure totally changed.

Again, its common when companies face bankruptcy so you can keep you management that you need to proceed.

 

[1bigun11]

I dont think people really get the pay structure change.
its not that they just got a raise but they got their pay structure totally changed.

Again, its common when companies face bankruptcy so you can keep you management that you need to proceed.

I dont know man. There has been a lot of talk in this thread about incompetent, over-paid labor being the cause of Hostess's problems. Seems that there is no shortage of incompetent, over-paid managers at that company as well. Well at least they were incompetent at running the company. They seem very adept, however, at giving themselves pay raises and securing life rafts for themselves while the workers go down with the ship or drown.

That may very well be the way things are done nowadays in management circles. But it still seems shitty to me.

 

[MorganKane]

I dont know man. There has been a lot of talk in this thread about incompetent, over-paid labor being the cause of Hostess's problems. Seems that there is no shortage of incompetent, over-paid managers at that company as well. Well at least they were incompetent at running the company. They seem very adept, however, at giving themselves pay raises and securing life rafts for themselves while the workers go down with the ship or drown.

That may very well be the way things are done nowadays in management circles. But it still seems shitty to me.

Sorry to say but labor is a dime a dozen.
Some people got skills that companies are willing to pay for but most dont.
Management (as in top management) is much harder to find.
Its a reason they are so sought out and gets paid a bunch.
Pretty much the same as professional football coaches, etc.

If you are in bankruptcy you need to keep your existing team on-board until you can complete it.
If you are paying your top management performance based pay as in quarterly and yearly bonuses then you need to change pay structure since its going away.
Changing pay structure in this case means salary, to match what they were making you must increase the salary.
The judge thought they paid themselves a bit too much.

I dont think the Hostess case is about over paid bakers but an unwilling union.
The company MUST cut cost to stay alive. Its not a choice but a MUST.
People still think that companies got unlimited amount of money, same goes for the government on both local, state and federal levels.
its not the case, far from it. Just look at Greece and Spain as a few example.

It does not matter how good those bakers are if the company can't afford to stay alive.
Something got to give.

Unions makes things very costly way too often. This time it costs every worker their jobs.
Its unfortunate but I think this is one of the cases where the bakers got what they deserved.
its not often you hear the Teamster say what they said and it speaks volumes.

If you run your own business you see things totally different then if you are an employee.

Personally I think a business best asset are employees but even they got a certain value.
When they think they are worth more then they really are then its time to replace them.

 

[BigGameHunter]

This has been eye opening for me. I see some of the good that your unions do, in regards to safety etc. point taken. Mgmt vs employees is something I dont understand...Ha I suffered from it when I was mopping hot tar for 13.25 per hour. I guess I learned it. I learned something else when I started my companies, and that is to treat good help great. And the minute you see bad behavior in one employee you bounce his/her ass out as fast as the law will allow. Bad attitudes are toxic to any enviornment.

If a person came and reviewed our books at the wrecker svc. They would see our biggest year we grossed over 3 millon. Makes me rich right? The reality is I only kept 12% was profit about 360K. The IRS was sitting back with a big shit eating grin and they got their cut, workers comp, FICA, MED, SSI and health care (pre mandate I might add).....The rest went to pay off a Kenworth 270. When all the dust settled, I actually made what one of my best employees did very close to 100K. There are lots of variables in there but its an example of what goes on behind the scenes.

Its also an example of respect between employee and owner. I pay my guys good because I respect them. They didnt have to strike or fuck with me to earn that status.

Oh by the way its Thanksgiving and Im sleeping down here working, all my staff are home with faimly. One of my drivers has the flu so Im filling in for him. Happy Thanksgiving to all of my other faimly be safe out there.

 

[tommyguns2]

I won't argue about incompetent management, but it's a hell of a lot easier to get canned in management than if you're an incompetent union employee. These management guys gets canned all the time.

 

[1bigun11]

Sorry to say but labor is a dime a dozen.
Some people got skills that companies are willing to pay for but most dont.
Management (as in top management) is much harder to find.
Its a reason they are so sought out and gets paid a bunch.
Pretty much the same as professional football coaches, etc.

If you are in bankruptcy you need to keep your existing team on-board until you can complete it.
If you are paying your top management performance based pay as in quarterly and yearly bonuses then you need to change pay structure since its going away.
Changing pay structure in this case means salary, to match what they were making you must increase the salary.
The judge thought they paid themselves a bit too much.

I dont think the Hostess case is about over paid bakers but an unwilling union.
The company MUST cut cost to stay alive. Its not a choice but a MUST.
People still think that companies got unlimited amount of money, same goes for the government on both local, state and federal levels.
its not the case, far from it. Just look at Greece and Spain as a few example.

It does not matter how good those bakers are if the company can't afford to stay alive.
Something got to give.

Unions makes things very costly way too often. This time it costs every worker their jobs.
Its unfortunate but I think this is one of the cases where the bakers got what they deserved.
its not often you hear the Teamster say what they said and it speaks volumes.

If you run your own business you see things totally different then if you are an employee.

Personally I think a business best asset are employees but even they got a certain value.
When they think they are worth more then they really are then its time to replace them.

Guess what boss? I do run my own business. And guess what else? It's not fucking bankrupt.

You dont have to treat people like they are a dime a dozen to make it. In fact, you will generate a lot more company loyalty and have a hell of a lot less labor problems if you avoid that attitude.

And if you are stupid enough to treat your employees so shitty that they organize and form a union; and are then so stupid to agree to provisions in your labor contract that tie your hands and make it impossible to get rid of bad employees; and are then so stupid to agree to over-pay the useless ones; can you really claim to be a managerial genius and blame your problems on the union?????

 

[StrongLyfe]

I won't argue about incompetent management, but it's a hell of a lot easier to get canned in management than if you're an incompetent union employee. These management guys gets canned all the time.

If they don't meet certain metrics or even simply because they don't click with the right people then they'd be shown the door. Top management people focus only on the numbers not much else...there are other people who sweat those other details

 

[marx]

Guess what boss? I do run my own business. And guess what else? It's not fucking bankrupt.

You dont have to treat people like they are a dime a dozen to make it. In fact, you will generate a lot more company loyalty and have a hell of a lot less labor problems if you avoid that attitude.

And if you are stupid enough to treat your employees so shitty that they organize and form a union; and are then so stupid to agree to provisions in your labor contract that tie your hands and make it impossible to get rid of bad employees; and are then so stupid to agree to over-pay the useless ones; can you really claim to be a managerial genius and blame your problems on the union?????

Brother, I've known you for years and gotta say thanks for pointing out the obvious.

Contracts are give and take affairs, like married folks splitting duties around the house, a bunch of give and take. If they agreed to overpay some workers their is a balancing out in another way. Something that was considered more important than pay. It is give and take, negotiation is the key word.

Management and people that carry out the work are in the same boat, they need to both do well by the other, the boat needs proper steering and proper motive force to see the journey carry on.

 

[marx]

I won't argue about incompetent management, but it's a hell of a lot easier to get canned in management than if you're an incompetent union employee. These management guys gets canned all the time.

Not a bad 'getting canned':

Even as it played the numbers game, Hostess had to face chaos in the corner office at the worst possible time. Driscoll, the CEO, departed suddenly and without explanation in March. It may have been that the Teamsters no longer felt it could trust him. In early February, Hostess had asked the bankruptcy judge to approve a sweet new employment deal for Driscoll. Its terms guaranteed him a base annual salary of $1.5 million, plus cash incentives and "long-term incentive" compensation of up to $2 million. If Hostess liquidated or Driscoll were fired without cause, he'd still get severance pay of $1.95 million as long as he honored a noncompete agreement.



The restructuring guy gets 125,000 a month, himself. You can do the math for that yearly...