2 weeks on 2/4 weeks off

[Rein]

Has any of you tried this cycling method suggested by Bill Roberts?

According to him gains aren't as dramatic as they would be on a longer cycle but so isn't suppression and recovery is so easy that the muscle mass gained in this short period of time is very easy to maintain during the off periods. Also he says that there isn't any post cycle crash.

I've done some research and most of the people who have tried this kind of cycling are very happy with the results.

Some do three 2 week cycles with 2 weeks off in a row and then stay off for about a month and repeat this while others prefer to do 2 weeks on 4 weeks off.

There is use of SERM's during the off weeks. 300mgs Clomid in the first day split in three doses followed by 50mgs for the remaining time.

http://www.mesomorphosis.com/articles/pharmacology/steroid-case-study-01.htm

https://thinksteroids.com/community/threads/2-on-4-off-cycles-br-dr-scally.134287264/

http://anabolicminds.com/forum/old-school-hormone/148166-bill-roberts-2-a.html

http://tnation.t-nation.com/free_on...ormance_bodybuilding_gear/2on2off_cycle_check

http://tnation.t-nation.com/free_on...mance_bodybuilding_gear/2_on_2_off_experiment

 

[BrotherIron]

2 week cycles? Personally, I think that would be a waster. SHIC's that we ran in the past were at least 4 weeks and many were 6 weeks.

 

[ajdonutz]

Sounds odd to Me, but I'm giving the test base all off season with an additional oral or injectable added at moderate doses and switched every 4 weeks this off season. Long ester would be 6 weeks, but I'm going strictly short.

 

[jandj0821]

I am with BI here on the waste part. Your not going to get the full effect in your blood levels in by 1 month on your longer esters let alone 2 weeks.

 

[dr jim]

No doubt BR is one of the most well informed and experienced BB/trainer/consultant in the business and I've rarely located ANYTHING I could disagree with especially from an evidence based persecutive, and these TWO week cycles are no exception.

However many mates don't follow or comply with the essence of his protocols and complicate the PCT process considerably.

A few examples include extending the 2 week cycle into a 4 week AAS run, using long rather than short or intermediate acting esters, believing the can cruise in between the "2 weekers" yet not need PCT thereafter.

Ergo if one intends to give these a try, understand the DESIGN and REASONING behind the protocols, themselves.

best
jim

Has any of you tried this cycling method suggested by Bill Roberts?

According to him gains aren't as dramatic as they would be on a longer cycle but so isn't suppression and recovery is so easy that the muscle mass gained in this short period of time is very easy to maintain during the off periods. Also he says that there isn't any post cycle crash.

I've done some research and most of the people who have tried this kind of cycling are very happy with the results.

Some do three 2 week cycles with 2 weeks off in a row and then stay off for about a month and repeat this while others prefer to do 2 weeks on 4 weeks off.

There is use of SERM's during the off weeks. 300mgs Clomid in the first day split in three doses followed by 50mgs for the remaining time.

http://www.mesomorphosis.com/articles/pharmacology/steroid-case-study-01.htm

https://thinksteroids.com/community/threads/2-on-4-off-cycles-br-dr-scally.134287264/

http://anabolicminds.com/forum/old-school-hormone/148166-bill-roberts-2-a.html

http://tnation.t-nation.com/free_on...ormance_bodybuilding_gear/2on2off_cycle_check

http://tnation.t-nation.com/free_on...mance_bodybuilding_gear/2_on_2_off_experiment

 

[Rein]

No doubt BR is one of the most well informed and experienced BB/trainer/consultant in the business and I've rarely located ANYTHING I could disagree with especially from an evidence based persecutive, and these TWO week cycles are no exception.

However many mates don't follow or comply with the essence of his protocols and complicate the PCT process considerably.

A few examples include extending the 2 week cycle into a 4 week AAS run, using long rather than short or intermediate acting esters, believing the can cruise in between the "2 weekers" yet not need PCT thereafter.

Ergo if one intends to give these a try, understand the DESIGN and REASONING behind the protocols, themselves.

best
jim

I am glad you agree Doc. I am willing to give this kind of cycling a try with various stacks before I bash it. It's just that too many people are satisfied and swear by it or even have their clients on this kind of cycles so I guess something is right about it even though it's completely contradicting what we know about cycling.

 

[dr jim]

They are remarkably successful for those less than 30-35 BUT in those instances where hypogonadism persists for a longer period several factors ring loud and clear.

Included are;
1) cyclist age above 35-40 years
2) using esters with half lives greater than THREE - FOUR days
3) NOT obtaining post-cycle labs to determine if endogenous TT and LH production have returned to their pre-cycle baseline

4) believing a 4 or 6 or 8 etc, week cycle is also GTG, NOT!
5) it also seems older folk are limited to the duration of "high potency" AAS such as Tren. These are best restricted to the FIRST week, IME.

6) Finally cycling with Nandrolone is problematic for MANY regardless of age and/or the attached ester because it's active metabolizes can CERTAINLY suppress the HTPA for much longer than 2-3 weeks.

The above is based on my OBSERVATION, EVALUATION and LAB TESTING of at least 100 patients trying BRs relatively new TWO WEEK cycling option. (Admittedly I suspect BR feels Nandrolone is GTG, not withstanding the ester, BUT IMO there are better more viable options for 2 week cycles.

So until you or whomever knows how your body will recover stick with Acetate or Prop esters (all oral are GTG because their half life is so short)

Finally I consider post-cycle labs MANDATORY since I estimate roughly 30-40% have NOT completed HTPA recovery after only a two week interval.

Obviously the net effect of the latter is some mates folks are actually "cruising" in between these 2 weekers and are actually cycling in a more traditional manner.
Best
Jim


--------------------___-----------_______

Has any of you tried this cycling method suggested by Bill Roberts?

According to him gains aren't as dramatic as they would be on a longer cycle but so isn't suppression and recovery is so easy that the muscle mass gained in this short period of time is very easy to maintain during the off periods. Also he says that there isn't any post cycle crash.

I've done some research and most of the people who have tried this kind of cycling are very happy with the results.

Some do three 2 week cycles with 2 weeks off in a row and then stay off for about a month and repeat this while others prefer to do 2 weeks on 4 weeks off.

There is use of SERM's during the off weeks. 300mgs Clomid in the first day split in three doses followed by 50mgs for the remaining time.

http://www.mesomorphosis.com/articles/pharmacology/steroid-case-study-01.htm

https://thinksteroids.com/community/threads/2-on-4-off-cycles-br-dr-scally.134287264/

http://anabolicminds.com/forum/old-school-hormone/148166-bill-roberts-2-a.html

http://tnation.t-nation.com/free_on...ormance_bodybuilding_gear/2on2off_cycle_check

http://tnation.t-nation.com/free_on...mance_bodybuilding_gear/2_on_2_off_experiment

 

[CBS]

6) Finally cycling with Nandrolone is problematic for MANY regardless of age and/or the attached ester because it's active metabolizes can CERTAINLY suppress the HTPA for much longer than 2-3 weeks.

The above is based on my OBSERVATION, EVALUATION and LAB TESTING of at least 100 patients trying BRs relatively new TWO WEEK cycling option. (Admittedly I suspect BR feels Nandrolone is GTG, not withstanding the ester, BUT IMO there are better more viable options for 2 week cycles.

Bill is not a fan nandrolone and has written about the prolonged suppression of the HPTA it causes independent of ester. I'm not going to bother with a link (they're easy enough to find) but he has stated nandrolone is NOT suitable for 2 week cycles for that reason.

 

[Rein]

Bill suggests using propionate or acetate esters and oral steriods for no more than 14 days. I tried 400mgs NPP for five weeks once and I don't think I am going to touch any form of Nandrolone again. It made me angry,depressed, I got very bad acne from it and it also killed my libido.

 

[dr jim]

Bill is not a fan nandrolone and has written about the prolonged suppression of the HPTA it causes independent of ester. I'm not going to bother with a link (they're easy enough to find) but he has stated nandrolone is NOT suitable for 2 week cycles for that reason.

Thx, nice to know we are in agreement, about Nandrolone for sure!
Best
Jim

 

[Rein]

I am wondering though if I am going to experience the same side effetcs with Tren Ace that I did with NPP. Although they are different compounds, they are both 19-Nor steroids.

 

[dr jim]

I am wondering though if I am going to experience the same side effetcs with Tren Ace that I did with NPP. Although they are different compounds, they are both 19-Nor steroids.

Correct they are similar.structurally yet are otherwise quite different as are their side effects. This first difference is their A/A ratio because while Tren has considerably androgenoc effects Nsndrolone is almost purely anabolic.

Actually cross reactivity between these the two AAS is quite low IME

Regs
Jim