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Women and 11oxo clones...?

TheDeadlifter

TheDeadlifter

New Member
Feb 3, 2013
4
0
I've been reading for weeks about the effects of T3, 11oxo, stano, Anavar, hdrol, etc on women. Interesting stuff. Decided to get my 33yr old wife on LGI's 11-X to start (same stuff as CEL 11-sterone). I was originally going to get her started on 11-X for cortisol control, but the fat-cutting effects at higher doses intrigued her. I've seen some men run 11oxo as high as a gram (or slightly more) per day, but that's not how I want to introduce my wife to a PH of any kind. I've read that doses of just 75mg/day were sufficient for some women. I was thinking starting at 150/day and possibly bumping it to 225/day after a couple weeks for more of a cut. She does some resistance training but focuses on running 5Ks so strength really isn't her goal (unfortunately). She carries a lot of fat in her midsection and butt even with a good diet and training program. I had mentioned running 11-X with low-dose hdrol over the summer but she wasn't thrilled about it.

My question: What might be a good dosage of 11-X for her to start?

(I posted this on another forum but got nothing...)
 
sassy69

sassy69

TID Lady Member
Aug 16, 2011
1,067
398
I honestly can't find much about women using that stuff.

Things that make me want to say don't spend time looking at controlled substances (and this includes t3!) - I don't know anything about your wife's stats or what her diet looks like or anything. I've seen plenty of chubby runners, aerobics & spin instructors to know even that much cardio doesn't guarantee a lean body.

This is written by one of the few people on the planet I go to w/ my own questions, and she is a former runner: http://www.ironmagazine.com/2009/daredevils-are-shredded/

I would REALLY encourage your wife to step back and look at the diet & training before using iffy PHs. I'd even say just simply start by posting a typical day's diet on the Diet forum here to get started. Women often have the challenge of trying to work w/ estrogen and the body it gives them. Guys frequently recommend drugs that appear to work great for them, and for a bunch of different reasons, it doesn't always (or usually) work quite the same. The biggest reason is the different dominant hormone and the lifestyle. And a fundamental rule is that NO supplement will do more than be a supplement to an already functioning, consistent and persistent diet, training & recovery program (i.e. your lifestyle). If what you're doing now isn't producing results, drugs are usually just going to make it worse. Particularly for women - if they are not already lean, throwing in androgens will frequently help build muscle mass - but w/ already higher bodyfat, that can just end up making them "thick".

I also wanted to post this article: http://athlete.io/5343/why-women-should-not-run/

Here's another article that is geared more towards lifting than running, but it also gives some discussion about the impact of running on the body in terms of "I'm a runner" and " I want to get lean".

The point being - if your wife is more of a runner than a lifter, fine. But if there's also a desire to accomplish a particular body composition change that isn't happening as a result of current diet & training. CHANGE the diet & training before looking for drugs. But more of the recent articles I've seen about running relative to women - if she trains for 5k's does she tend to run long periods of steady state? Does she do any sprint / interval training? THAT is one of the first things I'd put into the equation. Long periods of steady state tend to work against you, regardless of the calories burned thing. If she is already built like what sounds pear-shaped, she's also probably got challenges of natural estrogen levels (or equivalently could be low test levels - you can get that checked - and I would before assuming self-medication w/ steroids is the answer). But that doesn't mean she has to be a "victim" of her hormones. I can also attest to the long periods of steady state cardio - I started doing that under a prep coach's supervision around 2005 and continued it in conjunction w/ a ketogenic diet for the next 4 competitions I did. It is sort of 'necessary' on a keto diet because you are operating on no / extremely low carbs and you lose your ability to do any sort of explosive / sudden movements w/o getting light-headed. Noting I did NOT lose strength - in fact I did some of my biggest lifts on that diet, but not high rep / explosive lifting - so interval sprints would probably just leave me blacked out on the floor. But after all of that, I've noticed that I've "lost my kick". I'm not conditioned for sprint type work, so I need to change that. My guess is if she does the steady-state training w/o sprint training, it is just propagating her already estrogenic shape.

So two things I'd do:
1) post her diet - people always say they follow a "good" or "clean" diet, but aren't getting the results they want. Drugs are NEVER going to make up for an non-optimized diet. Your body can only respond to the environment you give it to operate in. If it isn't responding how you want, then you need to change the environment. DIET is always the first step.

2) Post her training regimen in detail - including the type of training she does for 5Ks. My guess is there's no sprint work - that alone will go a long way towards both her race training, her metabolism, her endurance, and probably to the end goal you' & she have in mind.
 
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oldnslow

Member
Jun 6, 2013
77
15
Good articles. Thanks. Passing them on to a stubborn cardio fan.
 
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