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Needing 1st cycle help...

P

PPL Pounder

Member
Sep 16, 2010
32
1
#1
Hey guys, I'm relatively new here, but of all the available sites, I feel this one is the best place to get first cycle advice.

First, some stats:
5'7" 176lbs
BF: 11-13%
Age: 31
Been lifting consistently for 4yrs. I'm more into strength training than bodybuilding. I feel I'm somewhat close to my natural peak. Plus, going through a divorce so I think I'm ready for the first AAS cycle.(super-motivated for obvious reasons;))

Here's what I'm thinking:

wks 1-10 Test E (500)(250-Mon & Thurs)

wks 1-4 TBol(oral) (40mg)

I'm thinking HCG, Arimidex and Nolvadex for ancillaries. I really need help with this part as far as when and how much.

I'm super prone to gyno,(actually have hardened lumps from puberty) which is odd because I've always been athletic and fairly lean. I already have finasteride for the innevitable accelerated hair loss. DHT blows!

My main goals are increased strength and hardness. I plan on sticking with my current strength training program.

As of now, my 1RMs are:
Bench-305(crappy upper body genetics:mad:)
Squat-465
Deadlift-505
Vertical-42"(really proud of this!)
Please critique away and help with ancillary times and dosages. Thanks.
 
Demigod

Demigod

VIP Member
Sep 24, 2010
583
27
#2
PCT to me has never been as complicated as some people make it...some folks can tell ya better than me but I've always recovered nicely. With test e I'd probably start around 14 days after the last inject...some would say start it immediately.
Here is a list of some of the AI's and SERMS you can use these are just suggested doses and lengths and will differ from person to person.
AI's:
Arimidex: 3-4 weeks @ .25mg or .5mg ed
Letro: 3 weeks @ .25 or .5mg ed
Aromasin: 3-4 weeks @ 20-25mg ed
proviron 3-4 weeks @ 25mg-50mg ed

SERMS:
Clomiphene: 4 weeks @ 100mg ed first 2 weeks, 50mg ed last 2 weeks.
Tamoxifen: 4-6 weeks @ 20mg ed (40mg ed for first 2 weeks if you wish)

Now there is lot's of way's to use HCG in your protocol...you can use it the last 2-3 week's of your cycle up until PCT at 250iu per day.
You can also run it throughout your cycle....some people use it the week of the halfway point of your cycle. Some people use it twice a week all the way through. You just need to find out what work's for you.....just giving suggestions.
 
big_paul_ski

big_paul_ski

MuscleHead
Dec 13, 2010
2,374
349
#3
i would keep this as simple as possible and extend to 12 weeks. i would also run the oral on he back end.

week 1-12 test E 500mg EW
week 1-4 tbol 40mg ED
week 9-12 tbol 40mg ED
weeks 3-day before pct HCG 250mg 2Xs EW
adex on hand

NAC (1200-2400mgs) and ALA (600mgs ed)
PCT
weeks 15-18

clomid 50/50/50/50
nolva 20/20/20/20
 
P

PPL Pounder

Member
Sep 16, 2010
32
1
#4
Good stuff! Thanks for the responses. I saw the sticky for NOOBS, I just was unsure what would change since I know gyno will be a problem. I'll post results when finished.
 
Get Some

Get Some

MuscleHead
Sep 9, 2010
3,441
643
#5
Read through my sticky for 1st cycles, there's a lot of complete info in there, especially for someone who's never injected before. Just know that you will be sore a day after injection. That can go away a quickly as 2 pins in the same location (3-4 weeks). Please be sure to be as sanitary as possible when injecting....it doesn't matter what dose of anything that you're on if you get a infection/abcess and have to cut the cycle short or lose confidence in injections.

I also have some pubescant gyno in my right nip. Adex takes care of it on cycle for me and I usually will run some letro short term before a cycle starts to get it as low as possible. That said, there is no reason NOT to run dbol for your first cycle. Some people love tbol, but personally I think Dbol is the single most effective steroid in history. You can run a moderate dose of 25mg-30mg ED and experience more gains than 50mg+ of tbol ED. Dbol did not worsen my gyno because I had adex handy and used it when needed. I'm tellin you, tbol is baby food compared to dbol...dbol is also cheaper and more readily available as well.

As far as PCT and HCG... run the HCG starting at week 5 or so twice weekly (250 IU) through week 8. Then stop until after last pin. HCG is used to simulate LH production in the testes, without it they will most certainly shrink. But, running HCG from week 5 straight through to week 14 and beyond can cause desensitization of the leydigs. Day 1 of week 13 run 250 IU EOD until PCT start. When to start PCT has been debated for some time now. I am convinced optimal restart time is when the HPTA is completely suppressed and the exogenous T is virtually gone from your system. If the half life of Test E is 5 or 6 days and your test levels at last pin are 2000, it can take 20-30 days to get to the point where you are fully suppressed. It doesn't make sense to try and recover when you're levels are still artificially high. You can only fool your body so much. The best way to confirm when to start PCT is lab results, but most people don't take the time to get those done.

And because you have to wait several weeks for your levels to drop, this is when I would consider running an oral. 10 weeks of test E followed by 3-4 weeks of dbol or tbol. The half life of these orals is 4-6 hours, so the levels come down much faster when quitting them. PCT can be started just a few days after your last tab.

I hope that gives you an idea. Let me know if you have any questions.
 
Deacon

Deacon

Old School Meso Vet
Oct 29, 2010
135
2
#6
your idea of test and tbol is fine - the test for 10 weeks and the oral for 4-5

in the old days that was usually a first cycle choice for many adding an injectable with an oral
 
P

PPL Pounder

Member
Sep 16, 2010
32
1
#7
Read through my sticky for 1st cycles, there's a lot of complete info in there, especially for someone who's never injected before. Just know that you will be sore a day after injection. That can go away a quickly as 2 pins in the same location (3-4 weeks). Please be sure to be as sanitary as possible when injecting....it doesn't matter what dose of anything that you're on if you get a infection/abcess and have to cut the cycle short or lose confidence in injections.

I also have some pubescant gyno in my right nip. Adex takes care of it on cycle for me and I usually will run some letro short term before a cycle starts to get it as low as possible. That said, there is no reason NOT to run dbol for your first cycle. Some people love tbol, but personally I think Dbol is the single most effective steroid in history. You can run a moderate dose of 25mg-30mg ED and experience more gains than 50mg+ of tbol ED. Dbol did not worsen my gyno because I had adex handy and used it when needed. I'm tellin you, tbol is baby food compared to dbol...dbol is also cheaper and more readily available as well.

As far as PCT and HCG... run the HCG starting at week 5 or so twice weekly (250 IU) through week 8. Then stop until after last pin. HCG is used to simulate LH production in the testes, without it they will most certainly shrink. But, running HCG from week 5 straight through to week 14 and beyond can cause desensitization of the leydigs. Day 1 of week 13 run 250 IU EOD until PCT start. When to start PCT has been debated for some time now. I am convinced optimal restart time is when the HPTA is completely suppressed and the exogenous T is virtually gone from your system. If the half life of Test E is 5 or 6 days and your test levels at last pin are 2000, it can take 20-30 days to get to the point where you are fully suppressed. It doesn't make sense to try and recover when you're levels are still artificially high. You can only fool your body so much. The best way to confirm when to start PCT is lab results, but most people don't take the time to get those done.

And because you have to wait several weeks for your levels to drop, this is when I would consider running an oral. 10 weeks of test E followed by 3-4 weeks of dbol or tbol. The half life of these orals is 4-6 hours, so the levels come down much faster when quitting them. PCT can be started just a few days after your last tab.

I hope that gives you an idea. Let me know if you have any questions.
I'm assuming that is slang for Arimidex? Also, what dose and when in cycle if I'm correct?
 
Bowhunter

Bowhunter

Senior Member
Oct 12, 2010
149
2
#8
PPL: You need to edit your post!! On virtually all boards, and I'm sure here, there is no open discussion about your sources, and certainly no listing of names! You are just asking for LE to pay you a visit.
 
P

PPL Pounder

Member
Sep 16, 2010
32
1
#10
I'm not asking for sources, I have that covered. Just asking if anyone has tried a particular brand. (ie.. Brittish Dragon, Balkan Pharmaceuticals etc...)

Am i wrong?
 
Last edited:
P

PPL Pounder

Member
Sep 16, 2010
32
1
#11
PCT to me has never been as complicated as some people make it...some folks can tell ya better than me but I've always recovered nicely. With test e I'd probably start around 14 days after the last inject...some would say start it immediately.
Here is a list of some of the AI's and SERMS you can use these are just suggested doses and lengths and will differ from person to person.
AI's:
Arimidex: 3-4 weeks @ .25mg or .5mg edLetro: 3 weeks @ .25 or .5mg ed
Aromasin: 3-4 weeks @ 20-25mg ed
proviron 3-4 weeks @ 25mg-50mg ed

SERMS:
Clomiphene: 4 weeks @ 100mg ed first 2 weeks, 50mg ed last 2 weeks.
Tamoxifen: 4-6 weeks @ 20mg ed (40mg ed for first 2 weeks if you wish)

Now there is lot's of way's to use HCG in your protocol...you can use it the last 2-3 week's of your cycle up until PCT at 250iu per day.
You can also run it throughout your cycle....some people use it the week of the halfway point of your cycle. Some people use it twice a week all the way through. You just need to find out what work's for you.....just giving suggestions.
Is that 3-4wks in if gyno problems onset or is that 3-4wks duration upon onset?
 
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