Largest Hospital System In N.Y. Drops Obamacare Plans Citing Major Losses

Discussion in 'The Lounge - Off Topic Chat' started by arnoldblack, Aug 28, 2017.

  1. FlyingDragon

    FlyingDragon VIP Member

    Nov 4, 2010
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    Everything I have read from the business papers (WSJ, Barrons) state the current radar system is not feasible and does not allow an airline to fly the shortest distance between 2 points....Again I am no airline expert. Every article points to the fact an updated system would save the airlines money and give the flying public a shorter flight exp....
     
  2. Swiper

    Swiper VIP Member

    Jan 8, 2011
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    i'm not sure you understand how free market capitalism works. do some research on it and you might learn something new. not to sound like a dick but a lot of people don't understand capitalism or have warped views on it.
     
  3. Dangling Unit

    Dangling Unit VIP Member

    Jan 2, 2011
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    It's not capatilism and yes, I know how it works. Again, please read up on the bill they're trying to pass and whom they want to hand it over to.
     
  4. Dangling Unit

    Dangling Unit VIP Member

    Jan 2, 2011
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    Trump wants to hand ATC over to the Russians.

    Sorry, I had to. haha
     
  5. HGH

    HGH VIP Member

    Jan 11, 2013
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    Wrong. Like I said there was no such thing as health insurance in 1776.
     
  6. HGH

    HGH VIP Member

    Jan 11, 2013
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    1. Health insurance is extremely new to human history.

    2. Our intelligent founders intentionally created a constitution with vague wording so it could be applied to new situations as society changes.
     
  7. Swiper

    Swiper VIP Member

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    lol please learn how to read, health CARE. The key word here is CARE. HealthCARE. do you understand now?

    and if you want to healthcare-insurance to be a right then you need to amend the constitution. go start a campaign to amend it. good luck with that
     
    Last edited: Sep 1, 2017
  8. FlyingDragon

    FlyingDragon VIP Member

    Nov 4, 2010
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    I dont understand your logic that an amendment is needed for healthcare to be a right. Can u please explain your point?
     
  9. Swiper

    Swiper VIP Member

    Jan 8, 2011
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    it's simple because congress has no authority to provide health care/insurance

    explain to me why they needed to amend the constitution to outlaw alcohol?
    because they knew congress didn't have the authority to outlaw it.

    read article 1 section 8 the powers of Congress. anything else that you want done can be done through the states not the federal government.
     
  10. Swiper

    Swiper VIP Member

    Jan 8, 2011
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    another good example is the post office . the federal government has authority to run the post office but they do not have authority to run healthcare or health insurance.

    does that make a little more sense?
     
    FlyingDragon likes this.
  11. shortz

    shortz Beard of Knowledge VIP

    May 6, 2013
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    Sorry, yes, it's state. I was thinking anything non-federal that isn't horribly run. The board certs are private though. The issue here is that only one board cert is recognized and there is no competition, so rates are insanely expensive. Other organizations are trying to come up on the scene that give the same level of cert, but the current boards are kicking and fighting to not allow anyone else to compete with them.

    I am a firm believer in peer systems too. A doctor should not be tried by a bunch of non-healthcare professionals on their decisions. These are not your "peers", the 18 year old kid that hasn't been to college yet or even seen real life anything etc.
     
  12. TheClap

    TheClap VIP Member

    Oct 25, 2011
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    (Okay I fucking ramble like a lunatic in this post, but I'm fucking pissed off about this situation and all the ways it touched my life. So read or don't. Just remember you are dealing with a baseline level of insane, (that I freely admit), as well as sleep deprivation. So enjoy.)

    I hate to say I agree, but I actually do agree in the context of what is said in this discussion so far. I'm no pilot, but I do work in healthcare (RN). And I am currently dealing with medical bills from a recent hospitalization that was forced upon me by this police state in which we are living. Yeah, police just have to say someone told them you made a suicidal statement and they can just Taser the living FUCK out of you. Then do it two more times, and then bean bag gun you for fun (okay they stopped after shooting me with three Tasers). They had bean bag guns but didn't use them. Otherwise this is no kidding, no exaggerations.

    I hate the police, the government and all their getting involved in our lives from an area that is intensely personal you understand? Tasers make things personal on a whole new level. Especially when you get shot from so close that 11/12 prongs sink into your skin. Barbed, copper prongs with beautifully coiled copper trailers spooling through the air until "donk" they find the sweet spot in your flesh. Makes things more personal when you were flat on your back instantly, not soon after, but instantly, as soon as the first four prongs from the first Taser sank into your flesh and began burning the skin and hair off. So those gentlemen in blue went ahead and shot 8 more prongs at you - hitting with only 7.

    Any time you lose consciousness because the police just keep going and going, and you had no weapon. And they stayed to chat long enough to verify you had no weapon and then those fucking thugs lit you up for fucking sport, you kinda learn to hate the police and everything they represent and support. Privatizing sounds like the only way to go to a guy like me based on principal, based on my experience.

    And I have to say that there are some places where regulation by more than the "invisible hand" is necessary. I would be wrong to state that the government has no proper place in our lives. A good example would be banking. What do you all think of the Federal Reserve? Good move Wilson or Hoover or whoever it was that got that part of our government privatized. You realize the Fed is a private bank right? A private bank with the freedom to keep it's records from the US govt just like the good banks in Switzerland. Oh and they can print and "create" money. But are we really better off with them? No, and the solution is not to just get a different private bank. And it's definitely not to give the Fed more freedom nor to deregulate them even more.

    Anyway back to my story: My insurance is shitty insurance, so basically I'm dealing with insurance that costs approx $500/month/person insured and doesn't pay for anything. It's a COBRA plan, and I only got this insurance because it retroactively paid for my hospitalization - again the hospital visit that was forced upon me. So a few months after being Tased and forced into a psych hospital for 5 days I get about $16,000 in medical bills from the ambulance I didn't ask for or need, the ER, the ER doc, the transport company that took me to the nut house, 15 or so other people with their fingers in the pot and so on.

    And get this, this is what a police state we live in. If someone with a medical doctorate degree thinks you should get locked up - no jury nothing - you're going to fucking go, and if you don't go willingly they'll fuck your shit up. Even if it's just so they can cover their ass in case you actually hurt yourself. I hope that makes sense. If they let you go home because you aren't actually suicidal and then you end up hurting yourself they have a problem. So just like EVERY SINGLE other area of medical care - it's cover your ass medicine above all else. Fuck what's right and true, out with being honest or anything else. Cover your ass.

    Get this, about eight hours after I got to the hospital, the govt organization tasked with crisis intervention came and threatened me that if I didn't sign their papers stating that I was willingly going to be thrown in the nut house I would be petitioned. Being petitioned means no more and no less than this conversation -

    "Sign this paper here and assume financial responsibility for everything that may happen to you medically for an undetermined number of days, or you will go down the other road and it will be a minimum of 5 days just to get you locked in a mental hospital. Then at least 5 more inside because you were court ordered, and then only a judge can let you out. So sign my paper sir, or God help you." This, again is no exaggeration. A dramatization yes. But the truth still the same.

    Anyway I'll try to get back to the point. Regulating what hospitals can charge, what insurance pays etc. You know what happened in the end when blood finally hit the water and the hospital declared that legally my insurance company was responsible for the bill and not me? The insurance company stepped up, negotiated $9,000 worth of bills down to less than my deductible, didn't pay a dime, sent me a letter saying "You're very welcome and make sure your $500 payment that only covers you is on time BITCH!"

    Do you think that hospital was willing to negotiate with me? Are you fucking dumb? You are if you think hospitals will negotiate with a private citizen because that answer is NO! they do not and will not, period. My cost for the hospital stay was $9k end of story. The invisible hand did not move that down one fucking inch. Matter of fact it's what keeps that there for a private joe like me. Because if the hospital starts giving private citizen the same fucking deal they give Cigna or BCBS? What is going to happen to that hospital?

    Well, the first one will probably get locked shut and burnt to the ground would be my guess. Because I've done the math over and over again and guess what? Even if my insurance company does have to pay in full on the bill from the ambulance and the ER doc, they'll still make a small profit after what I had to pay in back payments to get this plan to become retroactively effective so it covered my hospital stay. They'll pay what THEY have to pay and still get paid more by me. Because the hospital is not only allowed to charge me more money than they charge an insurance company, it is the only thing keeping their head on their shoulders. In the end, the reason I think regulation is in order is because we are dealing with crime. Bottom line, what happens between insurance and healthcare providers and humans is complete high crime and it has to fucking stop.

    Oh on a side note $571 dollars of my bill was for a 12-lead EKG that was never done. I brought it up with the hospital billing dept and they said to go fuck myself. Billing for services not rendered is a huge fucking crime. But I can't remember for the life of me what agency I report that to. Anyone know by any chance? I'd love to see this hospital get a nice $250,000 fine.

    Thanks,

    TC
     
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