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Kidney function Questions

W

Wilson6

VIP Member
Dec 17, 2019
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126
W6, I've been using ECA stack for my workouts...Twice a week for now...No other time...When I check bpm while on, my points only rise by 5...After workout bpm goes back to normal...Do u think this is to much...I don't check bp, it titrates back and forth due to pain...
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That's likely not significant, as long as you're not having sudden episodes of rapid HR or palpitations during the workout, or after. It's the sustained resting BP in conjunction with AAS that IMO is of greater concern. Twice a week vs all day every day is different. One variable that I would suggest to everyone to include in yearly labs or at the end of the cycle would be BNP (brain natriuretic peptide). It is a good reflection of ventricular wall stress and heart failure. If you're on a cycle, BP is high and running stimulants or clen along with it, probably wise to check BNP. If elevated there is probably some level of systolic or diastolic dysfunction going on that over the longer term could cause some serious problems. Just my non-medical opinion.
 
Determined

Determined

VIP Member
Apr 5, 2012
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During the 3 months did you still stick to your diet plan and training? I am planning on doing this and then taking a few days off training when i retest.i hope it helps
Cut back on red meats, and still training 5-6 days a week.
 
BackAtIt

BackAtIt

MuscleHead
Oct 3, 2016
1,517
384
That's likely not significant, as long as you're not having sudden episodes of rapid HR or palpitations during the workout, or after. It's the sustained resting BP in conjunction with AAS that IMO is of greater concern. Twice a week vs all day every day is different. One variable that I would suggest to everyone to include in yearly labs or at the end of the cycle would be BNP (brain natriuretic peptide). It is a good reflection of ventricular wall stress and heart failure. If you're on a cycle, BP is high and running stimulants or clen along with it, probably wise to check BNP. If elevated there is probably some level of systolic or diastolic dysfunction going on that over the longer term could cause some serious problems. Just my non-medical opinion.
No HR or palp's...No jitters, just sustained energy...I will cycle 2 weeks on, 2 weeks off...When off I feel the exact same...The only difference is when on, more (Sustained) energy, as if I carb'd properly...Can't even tell my heart is beating...

Again, your response is respected and greatly appreciated!...
.
 
BackAtIt

BackAtIt

MuscleHead
Oct 3, 2016
1,517
384
Cut back on red meats, and still training 5-6 days a week.
What made u cut back on r-meat if I may ask?...I did the same thing years ago do to gut and when I had to go make a delivery...Just curious if u had same issues?....
.
 
Determined

Determined

VIP Member
Apr 5, 2012
1,329
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What made u cut back on r-meat if I may ask?...I did the same thing years ago do to gut and when I had to go make a delivery...Just curious if u had same issues?....
.
Well red meat raises your creatinine levels I think. So I just stuck to other protein sources while I was worried about making sure I could get my creatinine level in range
 
BackAtIt

BackAtIt

MuscleHead
Oct 3, 2016
1,517
384
Well red meat raises your creatinine levels I think. So I just stuck to other protein sources while I was worried about making sure I could get my creatinine level in range
Gottcha...And yes, it does...
.
 
DungeonDweller

DungeonDweller

VIP Member
Mar 21, 2017
1,039
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Well red meat raises your creatinine levels I think. So I just stuck to other protein sources while I was worried about making sure I could get my creatinine level in range.
But if you are doing intense exercise you want more creatine? Has anyone considered "average" creatinine levels were determined by people who consider yoga their primary exercise.
 
Bigtex

Bigtex

VIP Member
Aug 14, 2012
587
889
Just a reminder that red meat is not the only meat that has creatine. The amount of creatine in most meats is pretty constant and varies between 4 and 5 grams of creatine per kilogram of flesh. Chicken breast contains about the same amount of creatine as cuts of beef and rabbit meat.
 
Determined

Determined

VIP Member
Apr 5, 2012
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Just a reminder that red meat is not the only meat that has creatine. The amount of creatine in most meats is pretty constant and varies between 4 and 5 grams of creatine per kilogram of flesh. Chicken breast contains about the same amount of creatine as cuts of beef and rabbit meat.
Didn’t know that!
 
JackD

JackD

Senior Moderators
Staff Member
Sep 16, 2010
5,462
796
You caught Covid? Any other issues?

there is a wide range of talk about the virus causing heart and kidney issues. Could be also related to a combination of diet, gear, and Covid.
 
Bigtex

Bigtex

VIP Member
Aug 14, 2012
587
889
I found an old posting I made on another board that might be good to read.


Just a heads up to those of us having blood monitored. If you get back a high creatinine reading and/or a low eGFR reading do not be alarmed, you most likely do not have kidney problems. High protein diets, high amounts of muscle mass and taking creatine supplements will definitely cause this. As we know creatine come from the protein we eat, the muscles store it. Creatine degrades to creatinine, especially with intense lifting.

1 October 2009. Related: Conference reports, PK and drug interactions, Side effects, Lipodystrophy Workshop (IWADRW) 11 Philadelphia 2009.

Several case studies showing the impact of creatinine supplementation on eGFR results, were presented in a poster by Graeme Moyle, from the Chelsea and Westminster Hospital, London. Estimated GFR is now routinely included in renal monitoring using the MDRD calculation, which incorporates serum creatinine, together with age, sex and ethnicity

Six HIV-positive male patients (aged 25- 55) on stable HAART were referred to an HIV/renal clinic due to elevated serum creatinine (range 131-257 umol/L) and low eGFR. All had normal blood pressure and no history of diabetes. Proteinuria levels were normal and confirmed by urinary protein:creatinine ratio. Each patient routinely used protein and creatine supplementation as part of a muscle-building gym routine.

Three months after 5/6 patients discontinued the supplements, serum creatinine levels consistently dropped to between 98 and 118 umol/L and eGFR reported to normalise (eGFR data was not shown).

Although dietary intake of creatine is 1g/day, supplementation can increase this 20-30 fold, and intramuscular concentrations can remain elevated for several weeks. Creatine is converted to creatinine, relative to its concentration, which can increase serum creatinine, despite normal renal function. The poster suggested that ARV exposure may also be involved but also that the association of raised serum creatinine with creatine ingestion has not been published outside of the HIV context.

COMMENT
This study highlights the importance taking a history of supplement use to consider this as a cause for elevated creatinine or low eGRF.

Moyle G et al. The pitfalls of the estimated glomerular filtration rate – ‘hitting the gym and creatine supplementation’. 11th Intl Workshop on Adverse Drug Reactions. 26-28 October 2009, Philadelphia. Poster abstract P27. Antiviral therapy 2009; 14 Suppl 2: A49.

Here is another one

J. M. Schedel, M. Tanaka, H. Tanaka, A. Kiyonaga, M. Shindo, P. Terrier, Y. Schutz. Consequences of one-week creatine supplementation on creatine and creatinine levels in athletes' serum and urine

https://core.ac.uk/display/18159763

We found that 30g/day (!) of creatine intake increased significantly creatinine serum level from 1.20mg/dl to 1.46mg/dl. After one week wash-out, it goes down back to 1.23. Of course, this increase is for a much higher dose than the 5g/day that you mention
 
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