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Chronic Tiredness

slicwilly2000

slicwilly2000

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Sep 14, 2010
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I have had this issue my whole life. My parents took me to the primary care doctor who referred them to an endocrinologist when I was 7 years old. I have consistently felt tired. I remember the endocrinologist ran a bunch of tests and found nothing out of the ordinary so he referred them to a neurologist who ran more tests and found nothing. I have repeated this same process multiple times as an adult. The end result is that I am then referred to a psychiatrist who prescribes prescription amphetamines. I've been clean off those for 16 years. Since then that's been the end result every time I see a new doctor. I am planning to have blood work done which I will post here to see if anyone sees anything out of the ordinary. There's a few things I find odd with whatever is going on. First I sleep for 10 hours each night. I wake up feeling refreshed. That feeling lasts for 15 to 30 minutes. That's enough time to make breakfast and start a pot of coffee. Then after coffee I feel awake for another hour. I then take a bunch of herbs that stimulate me enough to make it out of the house about 90 minutes later. If I wasn't taking those herbs I would go back to sleep. Before I starting taking the herbs I would go back to sleep and kill the rest of the day. The stimulating herbs are the only thing that wakes me up enough and keeps me awake enough to drive the 10 minutes to work. I'm then feeling good for the next 2 hours. The part that I haven't been able to figure out or make any sense of is that the tiredness comes in waves. I'll feel good one minute and tired the next. The tiredness feeling can last 5 minutes or it can last 2 hours. It's a constant yoyo, which is why the psychiatrist is pushing adderall yet again. I don't really care for how amphetamines make me feel or the person I am on them. I can be a real asshole and it alters my mood. I won't go back on those no matter how many times my current psychiatrist and all the previous psychiatrists suggest it. I had the 23andme testing. The person I hired to interpret those results suggested the herbs which help tremendously. It's the constant yoyo type effect that is incredibly perplexing, so I'm going to order blood work to see what the endocrinologist sees. I've seen a good half dozen endocrinologists or more over the course of my life. I'm sure some of them are incompetent, but surely they can't all be. Does anyone have any ideas of other tests to run or what this could possibly be? I'm looking for a new psychiatrist. I've also tried modafinil and while I am awake I feel exhausted all day. In the last 20 years I've seen at least a dozen different psychiatrists. I think the number is probably closer to 20. I typically see one until they insist on prescription amphetamines and then I find a new one and just repeat the process. I've been on ritalin, wellbutrin, and adderall in the extended release that last 8 hours and the tabs that last 4 hours. Without it I would have not made it through college. This caused a shitload of problems when I was a kid and even on ritalin I would still fall asleep in classes. I can't think of what this could possibly be and all the doctors I have seen are clueless. I spent part of today looking for a new psychiatrist.

I have had brain scans done. I've had wires hooked up to my head for testing. I've spent the better part of two weeks with one doctor or another in a hospital while they did testing and stuck me in various machines. I'm happy to detail the dosages of the different prescription amphetamines that I've been on if anyone thinks there is a point to that. All I can think of is that it's something hormonal due to the yoyo type effect. Some years are better than others. The current psychiatrist is also recommending antidepressants even though I rarely feel sad.

I don't usually open up online. This is likely the first time I've ever shared anything like this. I'm posting this because I feel I have exhausted every avenue that I know of. This board has the highest quality members of any which is why it's being posted here vs elsewhere.

Slic.
 
Lizard King

Lizard King

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Have you had a sleep study done slic?
 
macgyver

macgyver

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Nov 24, 2011
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Wow. That sounds tough.

I can relate a little but was only in that place for about 3 years. It was after a tbi that I suffered in 2009. Eventually we figured out my pituitary was likely damaged and I was both hypo thyroid and hypo gonadal.

Getting on trt and thyroid gave me my life back. I could sleep 12 hours and then be napping a few hours later. The fatigue was crushing and it was causing strain on my family. I would lay in bed till 1pm and could hear my kids having fun, and I could not drag my ass out of bed.

On an outside the box thing, I have found low dose tren to give me fantastic energy. Like not even wanting a nap and getting only 6-7 hours sleep some nights. In the range of 20-25mg/ day. I know there has been some study of it as an androgen replacement, so I am just throwing it out there. For ref, even with trt and thyroid I still generally ' need' 8 hours sleep and would take 9 if you have it to me. On low dose tren, I find I wake up before my alarm and feel great. Just sharing something outside the box.
 
DungeonDweller

DungeonDweller

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Mar 21, 2017
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I started having fatigue issues in my mid-30s that got steadily worse and eventually underwent a sleep study and was diagnosed with obstructive sleep apnea. Once I began using a CPAP machine while sleeping I got my life back.
 
slicwilly2000

slicwilly2000

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Sep 14, 2010
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Have you had a sleep study done slic?
I have had one or two over the years. They found nothing abnormal. I had a friend tell me this is sleep apnea but I had a sleep study done and they determined that was not correct. They said there was nothing abnormal about my sleep.

Slic.
 
slicwilly2000

slicwilly2000

VIP Member
Sep 14, 2010
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Wow. That sounds tough.

I can relate a little but was only in that place for about 3 years. It was after a tbi that I suffered in 2009. Eventually we figured out my pituitary was likely damaged and I was both hypo thyroid and hypo gonadal.

Getting on trt and thyroid gave me my life back. I could sleep 12 hours and then be napping a few hours later. The fatigue was crushing and it was causing strain on my family. I would lay in bed till 1pm and could hear my kids having fun, and I could not drag my ass out of bed.

On an outside the box thing, I have found low dose tren to give me fantastic energy. Like not even wanting a nap and getting only 6-7 hours sleep some nights. In the range of 20-25mg/ day. I know there has been some study of it as an androgen replacement, so I am just throwing it out there. For ref, even with trt and thyroid I still generally ' need' 8 hours sleep and would take 9 if you have it to me. On low dose tren, I find I wake up before my alarm and feel great. Just sharing something outside the box.
Did you see an endocrinolgist that determined the thyroid and gonadal issues? I did 12 hours last night. I can easily do 14 to 16 hours if I have nothing I have to do the next day. I've had times in my life where I slept for over 24 hours straight with only getting up to use the bathroom. 24 hours is not normal but it has happened in the last year.

Slic.
 
macgyver

macgyver

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Nov 24, 2011
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Did you see an endocrinolgist that determined the thyroid and gonadal issues? I did 12 hours last night. I can easily do 14 to 16 hours if I have nothing I have to do the next day. I've had times in my life where I slept for over 24 hours straight with only getting up to use the bathroom. 24 hours is not normal but it has happened in the last year.

Slic.
I have a really good GP. I kept complaining about fatigue (chronic) and eventually he did a full hormone panel. It was about 4 years after a TBI closed head injury. The injury motivated me to get back in the gym. I was in the best shape I had been in since my 20's but I felt worse and worse. I completely understand the crushing fatigue. My doc said it is likely the head injury damaged my HTPA. At the end of the day, he put me on TRT and T3 supplementation. We did them one at a time. But it really gave me my life back.

When you are in a bad place, you sometimes forget what 'normal' is like. It was really hard. The weird thing is I had no symptoms other than fatigue. My drive was normal etc. I was still natural lifetime at the time, and most people would have assumed I was cycling. I had no issues with mass or strength. Just fatigue.

I dont know if you have played with anabolics in the past, but low test can definitely make one feel tired. I do recall that you said this has been a lifelong issue, but on somethings I have dealt with for a long time, I realize my memories are not always as linear as I thought. Maybe a journal might help you identify various variables...etc.


I just took a stab with the hormonal route since it is an obvious one. Need to find a GOOD doc. My thyroid is 'sub clinical'. But my test was below bottom of the scale. A lot of dr's would say my TSH was not high enough to need thyroid treatment, but it really has helped me out. When you read on it, there is a lot of disagreement about where true low thyroid starts. Kind of like a doc telling a guy with 275 test that his levels are 'in range'.

Good luck man.
 
slicwilly2000

slicwilly2000

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Sep 14, 2010
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This issue has been going on since I was a child. It's why they put me on prescription amphetamines. Getting a script for adderall is incredibly easy. I believe there is 3 different tests for thyroid and 2 for testosterone. TSH, T3, T4 for thyroid and total test, free test for testosterone. I have zero chance of my primary care doctor doing anything whatsoever. My doctors just pass the buck and won't do shit to help.

Slic.
 
slicwilly2000

slicwilly2000

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Can anyone advise what I should all have lab work run for?

Slic.
 
macgyver

macgyver

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Nov 24, 2011
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Can anyone advise what I should all have lab work run for?

Slic.

To keep you from going in the hole crazy, I think you could just start with a basic TSH and 'bio available' testosterone.

The TSH will give you an in indication whether your body is trying to pump out my thyroid. Between resting body temp and TSH you should be able to get a decent marker on overall thyroid performance. When I was low-thyriod, my body temp was always about a full degree low. As soon as my thyroid was corrected, I have been normal ever since.

The 'bio available' testosterone test is less accurate than direct by radioassy, but it is cheaper and will tell you the broad overview of where your levels are at.


My doc started with those and once they showed issues, he started going deeper into blood work. If you are going to self medicate, it is pretty easy to see where you are. My doc adjusted my thyriod with direct T3 rather than Synthroid..etc. It was the easiest way to see if it would correct my fatigue issues. T3 is very fast acting. I have a script for 50mcg/day. But I take a 1/4 in the am, and 1/2 before bed. (I bite them in half and then the half in half for the 1/4 dose). I used to take hale am and half pm but my doc wanted me to try dropping the dose just a bit. (I could not tell the difference dropping it so I have stuck with the 37.5mg
 
JackD

JackD

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Sep 16, 2010
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I hate that you have to go through this. It sounds a lot like a form of Narcolepsy. Has a Dr ruled that out?

I do understand what you are going through. I deal with constant fatigue all day. Moments in the afternoon where I feel I could just pass out. Some days I used to get home and fall asleep till the next day. Some days my nap was 5 hours long.

I have some questions, do you have allergies? Or allergic to anything? Have you been checked to see if you have Anemia? Have you been checked to see if you can absorb B vitamins? Do you have any Kidney or liver problems? Do you have acid reflux? or Acid Issues? Do you ever do deep breathing?

I have found that carbs in the morning make me Sleepy, and really just to many carbs in general zaps my energy. So I have some throughout the day, but I keep them low and have higher fat. Otherwise, I cannot function. The recent addition of the Sublingual B complex has made me feel a whole lot better.

So, I am not sure what you take, but this is what I've been doing over the last several years and I think I've finally found a combination.

Morning. Empty Stomach
Co-Enzyme B Complex
Sublingual B-Complex
500 Mg Vitamin C
Probiotic Garden of Life Men
SharpMind.
Rholodia Extract.
Natures Way Alive Garden Goodness Men
2 Cups of Coffee

Then I mix up a Shake with Whey Protein, Banana, Frozen Mixed Berries, Green Superfood, Peanut Butter, Organic Superfood Energy Blend, with Some Milk.

Before bed, I take this.
Valerian Root Extract
10 Mg Melatonin
Calcium, Magnesium, Potassium
Vitamin C
Vitamin D
Omega 3 fatty acids

Today I didn't follow my shake, went to brunch, and guess what? Been tired all day, Yawning, and really just trying to stay awake.
 
macgyver

macgyver

TID Board Of Directors
Nov 24, 2011
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@slicwilly2000 Forgot to add to the above, have your vit d levels checked. Vit d is not really a vit. It is better thought of as a master hormone. Vit d deficiency can cause all kinds of issues, even low t...etc. Always a good idea to rule that out. Go for the low hanging fruit first!
 
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