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bulk to cut transition plan
- Thread starter shan
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- bulk cut plan transition
sassy69
TID Lady Member
- Aug 16, 2011
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FWIW I've had oily skin all of my life - its actually settled down some since my late 30s (hormone levels dropping) and no wrinkles
Just the forehead lines that I've had since I was a kid.People tend to stack proviron w/ nolvadex going into show date as they are "synergistic" and have been recommended as a competition cutting stack since the early days of WAR / Anabolics 200x. Nolva acts to interrupt the estrogen process by faking out estrogen receptors (read about SERMs - selective estrogen receptor modulators) while proviron is a highly androgenic steroid (yes it is still a steroid) that does not convert to estrogen so no water retention, and is geared very much towards promoting tightening, particularly in the mid-section.
By itself, nolvadex will still work towards interrupting the estrogen-pattern bodyfat depositing. Proviron basically supplements that by working on the testosterone / androgenic side. Both (or either) are not recommended to run for more than 8 weeks. I would probably suggest longer than 4 weeks tho - for women, since you're manipulating your hormone levels, your menstrual cycle tends to respond by spending the first month in this environment, trying to figure out what's going on. This can result in break thru bleeding, no period or unusually heavy period. If you give it more than 4 weeks, then your system has more time to figure it out and most likely will pick to just stop flow for a while. No guarantee you won't still experience your usual menstrual cycle water retention or mood swings, just w/o the flow. So something to check is when your regular period will land relative to your show date. No guarantees w/ this - if you're running cycles during your show prep, most likely you're running them longer than 4-8 weeks. As such, a steroid cycle, on its own, and probably also just the bodyfat loss will contribute to interruption of your period (flow - reference amenorrhea).But for this stack specifically, the recommended shorter run won't necessarily give your body long enough for it to adjust to the changing hormone levels to decide if its going to flow extra hard, or just stop. This can just be very inconvenient as you come into show day.
The reason for the short recommended cycle for nolvadex is that long-term use of it can promote early menopause (which has its own set of issues). Proviron, as mentioned, is very androgenic - so longer term use of it can lead to very androgenic sides. Normally people don't run proviron for a long time because it does nothing for muscle growth (very, very low anabolic component), so I wouldn't say I've ever really heard of anyone runniing into bad androgenic sides as a result of it.
Melanotan will not give you a tan dark enough to replace stage tan. A caveat on MT2 is that it also darkens any freckles you may have or have but can't see. It might promote lots of dark freckles that looks like black spots. To that end, you'd definitely need stage tan just to even that out. I've also heard of women growing darker, thicker hairs (like on your arms), and taking too much or using it too long at a higher dose (i.e. as you go, you'd probably want to either lower the dose or extend the interval between doses) to avoid getting sick - basically too much of it in your system can promote feeling sick.
I personally used it several years ago. The spots were the worst part for me - I'm already very light-skinned, and the spots really started looking black. I stopped because it wasn't worth it to me. Easy to just hit the tanning bed for shows, and not worry about a tan otherwise.
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NutNut
MuscleHead
- Jul 25, 2011
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Tanning in any sense darkens freckles they are after all concentrated spots of melanin, this is why it's a base tan as far as stage goes though you can get as dark or darker than needed for competition yes the further applications will cover up any blemishes.
I agree with alot of what you said sassy however "faking out estrogen receptors" made me chuckle. SERMs simply bind to estrogen receptors preventing estrogen from doing so its self. I'm sure shan knows that though given her background, just thought the explanation was cute.
I agree with alot of what you said sassy however "faking out estrogen receptors" made me chuckle. SERMs simply bind to estrogen receptors preventing estrogen from doing so its self. I'm sure shan knows that though given her background, just thought the explanation was cute.
SHINE
Friends Remembered
- Oct 11, 2010
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Since were on the topic of all the science *crap* lol ya think a slight taper with nolva would help the "coming off" of nolva and make for a smoother landing for the ladies Sass?
or maybe not? In theory makes sense but who knows if Janes system would react the same to that like it does in Joes. (real world experience counts for everything here kidz!)
or maybe not? In theory makes sense but who knows if Janes system would react the same to that like it does in Joes. (real world experience counts for everything here kidz!)
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sassy69
TID Lady Member
- Aug 16, 2011
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That's a totally valid point- there's precious little research for women. Further, in many cases where women choose to use estrogen inhibitors of some sort, its usually in a competition scenario. When the show is over, there's a certain amount of rebound already underway just from the change in protocol when you go from 12-20 weeks of strict dial in, heavy training & cardio, lots of stress, water manipulation, switches to a post-show shitload that may or may not get reeled in.
Now let's compare w/ men - competition-level drops in bodyfat will often result in amenorrhea, not something that men deal with. Then in the first 1-2 weeks you can easily rebound from single digits up to 12-15%, Depending on where the menstrual cycle is after that, it might come back normal, it might take another month to come back, it might come back w/ a vengeance. So I don't know that you can necessarily compare men's response w/ women's response because women already have an inherent monthly estrogen cycle. If you do anything that invokes a dramatic change in the body's environment (and this can range from bodyfat drop, stress, AAS, nolva, arimidex, etc.), the female's body's survival response is to suppress the menstrual process to prevent a pregnancy in this less than ideal growth environment.But every month, it is trying to do what it does. Many women can attest to things like breakthru bleeding, inhibited period or dramatic bump in period from the effect trying a new birth control (change in hormone levels), AAS (change in hormone levels), weight loss, etc. and it seems to happen during the change. After the body has settled into more of a homeostasis, it will either go to 'no period for a while' or 'back to normal'.
Now granted I'm not 100% familiar w/ the male equivalent - I understand when a guy goes on a cycle, after a certain period of time w/ exogenous test in place, his body is going to turn off natural test, and then it takes PCT to get things rolling again. But outside of that, and maybe age promoting low test, what is the equivalent that is going to be a natural & cyclic force to get an already very strong hormone surge going again? If you have an artificially induced suppression of it and then drop that suppression suddenly, what do you expect to happen?
I'm sure there's lots of hand-waving and approximations if we tried to look at it scientifically - it seems like there's a sliding scale between 'has influence' and 'no more influence' that is going to be dependent on the individual as well. Again, given the range of experiences women have w/ their natural hormone levels (i.e. think of all the women you've known over the years, and how each of them managed during 'that time of the month' -- that's just the natural changes. Now imagine turning it off totally while it waits to surge again on the next unaffected month.)
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shan
TID Lady Member
- Jul 1, 2011
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