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Anyone Watching the Derek Chauvin Trial?

69nites

69nites

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Aug 17, 2011
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Then Chauvin is guilty because there is no such restraint or hold that is taught to restrict the airway in LE besides the lateral vascular neck restraint (which essentially a rear naked choke and many states do not teach this tactic. PPCT I believe does but not all states do. I've never heard of any LE training that would endorse knee on the neck. The question is was his knee on the neck. The defense argues his knee was on the shoulder blade not the neck. I am not going to argue that Floyd did not die of aphyxiation.
The question is was it due to the tactic used or was it due to other elements.

Watch the whole footage from the bodycams. He was saying he could not breath prior to being taken out of the squad car. He also is heard once on the ground he ate the drugs he apparently had purchased from the drug dealer. These at minimum could be contributing factors to his death. You have 3 times the lethal amount of fentanyl in your system, you're likely a dead man walking. Where Chauvin may have faltered was rendering aid for a possible overdose. That issue is going to be hard to defend.
That isn't what I'm necessarily saying. I will say if you hold a choke after the person passes out at a minimum that's negligence.

I would feel exactly the same if it happened in my gym.

Being trained a technique to cuff a non-compliant suspect isn't the same as being trained as a long term restraint. That's like saying they were trained to shoot center mass, they can do it whenever they want, context doesn't matter.

The position is your knee on the shoulder with your shin across the back of the neck. The weight is distributed across your knee, not just the knee

If you go back to the video and watch for when Floyd lost conciseness, at that moment there was no justification for any use of force. The last breath a saw Floyd take was 2 minutes before the medics arrived.

They continued highest use of force on a dead guy for 2 minutes. Hard to ignore that.

Either way these cops need grappling training. This brought up a lot of conversation with my grappling group about how these officers were not confident in their skills and felt they needed 3 to restrain 1 cuffed suspect with a choke. I have a 17 year old kids that I have 60 lbs on that can hold me prone in cuffs using knee on back. Why is this kid more competent than 4 officers?
 
gunslinger

gunslinger

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Sep 19, 2010
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That isn't what I'm necessarily saying. I will say if you hold a choke after the person passes out at a minimum that's negligence.

I would feel exactly the same if it happened in my gym.

Being trained a technique to cuff a non-compliant suspect isn't the same as being trained as a long term restraint. That's like saying they were trained to shoot center mass, they can do it whenever they want, context doesn't matter.

The position is your knee on the shoulder with your shin across the back of the neck. The weight is distributed across your knee, not just the knee

If you go back to the video and watch for when Floyd lost conciseness, at that moment there was no justification for any use of force. The last breath a saw Floyd take was 2 minutes before the medics arrived.

They continued highest use of force on a dead guy for 2 minutes. Hard to ignore that.

Either way these cops need grappling training. This brought up a lot of conversation with my grappling group about how these officers were not confident in their skills and felt they needed 3 to restrain 1 cuffed suspect with a choke. I have a 17 year old kids that I have 60 lbs on that can hold me prone in cuffs using knee on back. Why is this kid more competent than 4 officers?
I'm not gonna get into the politics of it (I'm sure most know where I stand) But I 100% agree that cops should have grappling training. Id say at the very least a blue belt level in BJJ. I have been doing Jiu-jitsu for 21 years and have been teaching for 10. Any of my blue belts could hold down the average 200 pound guy without much effort. IMHO if an officer cannot hold down an average untrained guy for at least 3-5 minutes (long enough for backup) They have no business being a cop. (Yes I'm also a former cop) And yes I realize this would get rid of a lot of their token females. So be it. If you can't do the job you don't need to be there.
 
DungeonDweller

DungeonDweller

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Mar 21, 2017
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Got a txt last night from someone in the Folwell Neighborhood of Minneapolis saying the National Guard were hanging out nearby. This morning got another txt saying it was a quiet night.
 
hawkeye

hawkeye

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I'm hoping for resolution. I will make mince no words that both officers should have a level of accountability. I do not believe either officer had racial motivation. The female officer plain and simple fucked up. I don't think she intentionally drew her service weapon in lieu of her taser. Sadly, 26 years of service will mean nothing in the courts eyes. In fact

, it will be likely used against her as she was a field training officer. It sucks, but she will be held accountable for the loss of a human beings life. I wish people would focus more on the loss of life than the color of skin.

Two families will be affected by that outcome. The officer's and the young man's whose life was lost. It sucks. The vicarious liability some professions have is crazy. But she knew the risks. A split second decision can end a life and one's career. I've watched the body cam video several times and cringe every time. I feel for the officer and I feel for the victim. But it should have never gone that far. Compliance, people.

As for Chauvin, I don't agree with all of Chauvin's actions. But I also was not there and through the trial, I have learned that the media took parts of the story and gas lighted it. There is much more to the incident than the common person knows. The only image that most have seen is Chauvin on top of Floyd. Knee on neck or knee on shoulder blade. It's anyone's call. What I don't believe is there was an intentional action to end Floyd's life. I also think the social pressure and spotlight on this case is like a powder keg read to explode. It's going to be interesting to see the verdict.

I am an ex-LEO. I've dealt with people of all race and backgrounds. In my 12 years, I do not think race was ever an issue, but been plenty of time called racist and other names. There are good and evil people alike out there. My biggest issue is the broad brush stroke of public opinion regarding law enforcement. I've been out of for quite some time and I am so glad I am. I wouldn't want to put up with the BS that many officers deal with. Are their LEO's that are power hungry pricks? Absolutely. I've dealt with plenty. But I've met plenty that do the job.

I don't know what the answer is, but I think continual training, yearly psychological/personality evaluations, and programs such as community policing are a start. But I also think many factors that are beyond law enforcement are glaring. Socio-economic backgrounds and demographics are factors in percentages of offenders. I've always told people that I treat people the way I would expect to be treated, and I treat people how they treat me. Right or wrong, I don't think it's that hard to do.

Just my two cents.....
 
DungeonDweller

DungeonDweller

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Chauvin's defense finished their case this morning....
 
69nites

69nites

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Aug 17, 2011
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In your opinion, how did it go? I haven't had the chance the last couple days to watch it.
I intend on being on a camping trip when the verdict comes in. A full acquittal wouldn't surprise me at all. Ready for fires.
 
SAD

SAD

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Feb 3, 2011
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I was pretty shocked at that bullshit.
It’s not like I have a dog in this fight, other than wanting to believe in a fair trial, but looking through the evidence and listening very carefully to the closing arguments, I’m genuinely upset that not one fucker on that jury said “no, fuck you guys, this is wrong”.
 
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