Latest posts

Forum Statistics

Threads
27,822
Posts
546,527
Members
28,652
Latest Member
miclejack
What's New?

Anti-Smooth Muscle Antibody / Auto-Immune Hepatitis - Positive Test

test
Pig Vomit

Pig Vomit

VIP Member
Nov 12, 2022
359
517
I had some elevated liver and kidney readings about a month finishing up a cycle, which, at my age, I really had no business running some of that stuff. But what's done is done. So that led me down a path of *extensive* kidney and liver tests. You name it, I've had it, everything short of a liver biopsy. So I stopped everything except TRT (prescribed and monitored by an endocrinologist) over a year ago. The testing eventually included the test in the thread title, and the first test was negative, all the other tests were normal except for the elevated blood test results, which eventually all came back down into the normal range. I didn't even know what the Anti-Smooth Muscle Antibody test was for, and since the first one was negative, didn't bother to look it up. Then, all of a sudden on a subsequent test two months later during which time I wasn't using anything, I tested positive. That led me to research the heck out of the test, which meant I had autoimmune hepatitis, which could also mean cirrhosis of the liver. But none of the other tests indicated cirrhosis or traditional hepatitis, and like I said, all the other liver tests were normal.

Three months after the initial positive test, wanting to make sure it wasn't a false positive, I tested positive again. Three months after that, I tested negative. While that's a relief, I'm totally confused as it's not supposed to go back to negative after two positives.

The positive tests which caused me to stop all supplementation are the reason I've not been visiting the board lately.

So everything is trending well again, I have an appointment to discuss results in a few weeks.

Wondering if anyone else has had a positive test for this, and if so, whether it eventually turned negative again, what the doc told you, etc. Also wondering if any of the more scientific folks here can shed any additional light.

Now that everything is back to normal.....I'm so damn tempted to start up again, albeit with milder substances. I'm gonna wait, but I've got a fair amount of stuff stocked up I'd like to get through before I get any older, but at the same time, don't want to risk kidney/liver disease.

All replies are greatly appreciated.
 
JackD

JackD

Senior Moderators
Staff Member
Sep 16, 2010
6,483
1,707
Well first, I would suggest that you baby that liver of yours and take Liver care from here on out. I would not use anything ever again that can cause any type of liver or kidney damage.

Essentially what you did is create an environment over the years for this to happen. ie… compounds that go through the liver and cause damage. The liver is forgiving, but also it stops forgiving as well. You are probably on the verge of Autoimmune Hepatitis. The fact that you remained positive for months is a good indicator of your organs are borderline to this disease now. If you want to run compounds again, you are certainly taking the risk to give yourself the disease that you can’t bounce back from. Just saying, once the damage happens, it only gets worse. If you keep doing stuff to make it worse. Case point, don’t use and Risk organ failure.
 
MR. BMJ

MR. BMJ

Senior Moderators
Staff Member
Sep 21, 2011
2,703
2,729
What were the elevated values from the liver and kidney tests that were performed?

I'll ask more after this.
 
Pig Vomit

Pig Vomit

VIP Member
Nov 12, 2022
359
517
What were the elevated values from the liver and kidney tests that were performed?

I'll ask more after this.
Here is my current Comprehensive Metabolic Panel from this week. The liver panel was from about 3 months ago. I've had so many tests over the last year. If you're looking for a specific test, let me know. I can also post graphs of specific tests if you like so it shows the history. Just ask, I'll post.
 

Attachments

  • PV Blood.jpg
    PV Blood.jpg
    73.7 KB · Views: 64
  • PV Liver Panel.jpg
    PV Liver Panel.jpg
    27.1 KB · Views: 67
Last edited:
Pig Vomit

Pig Vomit

VIP Member
Nov 12, 2022
359
517
Liver Panel from 10 mos ago a couple weeks after ending cycle.
 

Attachments

  • PV Liver 10 mos ago.jpg
    PV Liver 10 mos ago.jpg
    27.1 KB · Views: 66
MR. BMJ

MR. BMJ

Senior Moderators
Staff Member
Sep 21, 2011
2,703
2,729
PV, those are typical, actually they are very good, markers for anybody who uses and trains hard. The liver values from 10 months ago are just slightly elevated. They can fluctuate back and forth depending on how active you are, and how hard you train. Are you training as hard now as you were then? Also, how many days after training did you get blood work, both 10 months ago and present?

I can't remember what you took at this point.

Personally, i'd be happy with even the results from 10 months ago, and i'd not worry about it.
 
R

rawdeal

TID Board Of Directors
Nov 29, 2013
4,455
3,681
. . . . So everything is trending well again, I have an appointment to discuss results in a few weeks . . . .
Was there any discussion 10 months ago when the doctor decided to order the "extensive" tests, or was he just going by a few of your numbers on the basic tests? I'm wondering if most of us would show similar numbers on our basics, but if our doctors did not order the same "extensives," we'd never know what has you worried currently.

Does that original doctor or any others know what you'd been doing before those basic tests?

What was the cycle that included some stuff you "had no business running" at your age?
 
Pig Vomit

Pig Vomit

VIP Member
Nov 12, 2022
359
517
I don't know. The whole auto-immune hepatitis postive tests scare the crap out of me. I have had ultrasounds, CTs, etc., everything short of a biopsy, and everything is normal. Yet two positive tests in a row after a negative test, and now back to negative. I'd still like to hear more from people and I'm happy to post more test results, but I'm gonna stay clean until I've strung a few negative tests together and had a good run of blood tests and I'll reconsider. I've never been a heavy or non-stop user and my police career stopped things for quite a few years due to fear of being in an incident and being tested.

The things I should not have been running included Tren, Masteron and Superdrol (not all at the same time). The rest of the stuff not so concerning.

The doctors do not know about the juice, but I have been asked. I have reasons for not admitting. While I certainly don't look like I used to, I'm still big and fit for my age. I still go to the gym everyday, but due to the need for a shoulder replacement, I'm not lifting anywhere close to the poundages I used to. That having been said, I am going to failure but with much higher reps and lighter weights....almost every damned day.

This whole thing started because I noticed that my white blood cell count was either just under low normal or just above low normal for a couple years and I wanted to figure out what was going on. Obviously my concern was some sort of blood cancer, and that's been ruled out. But, in the course of testing to figure that out (we still don't know the reason), the docs saw other stuff was out of whack but I knew that was from juicing. But the docs didn't know that was the reason and I pleaded ignorance so they worked all that up as well, which was fine by me, because better to have too much info than not enough, and I had used enough so that I wanted to know. So.....been clean for about 10 months now other than doc monitored TRT.

Yet I'm feeling small, that dang body dysmorphia thing, even though I know I look better than 99% of guys my age, and I want more.

Since we're on the topic.....any opinions on HGH and how hard it is on the liver and kidneys?

Part of my kidney issues were related to way too much protein in my diet and not drinking enough water. That's changed.

But back to the autoimmune hepatitis.....I think the wise course of action is to stay clean for at least a few more months until I've had a string of negative tests and then reconsider. Perhaps it has something to do with the testing facility....which is inside my HMO's doc's office. Perhaps testing at an outside facility is warranted.

Oh, and to answer BMJ's question....I definitely trained the day before each test, if not just before (like an hour before).
 
Last edited:
Pig Vomit

Pig Vomit

VIP Member
Nov 12, 2022
359
517
Here is less than 2 years worth of tests, most recent first. So, yeah, shitloads of tests. If anyone wants to see specifics, let me know.
 

Attachments

  • PV Test List 1.jpg
    PV Test List 1.jpg
    28.2 KB · Views: 57
  • PV Test List 2.jpg
    PV Test List 2.jpg
    46.4 KB · Views: 60
  • PV Test List 3.jpg
    PV Test List 3.jpg
    50.7 KB · Views: 56
genetic freak

genetic freak

VIP Member
Dec 28, 2015
2,831
3,732
PV, those are typical, actually they are very good, markers for anybody who uses and trains hard. The liver values from 10 months ago are just slightly elevated. They can fluctuate back and forth depending on how active you are, and how hard you train. Are you training as hard now as you were then? Also, how many days after training did you get blood work, both 10 months ago and present?

I can't remember what you took at this point.

Personally, i'd be happy with even the results from 10 months ago, and i'd not worry about it.
That is how I read it. What exactly is the issue? Liver numbers post cycle, seem pretty normal if you ran orals. If your creatinine is not above normal, it just tells me you train like a pussy (I have heard this from Dante, Todd Lee, Justine Harris, Dave Tate and many others).
 
Pig Vomit

Pig Vomit

VIP Member
Nov 12, 2022
359
517
That is how I read it. What exactly is the issue? Liver numbers post cycle, seem pretty normal if you ran orals. If your creatinine is not above normal, it just tells me you train like a pussy (I have heard this from Dante, Todd Lee, Justine Harris, Dave Tate and many others).
Listen, fucker, and I say that with love, I'll admit to training like a pussy *now*, wait until you are my age, need a shoulder replacement, and (that's my biggest problem) see how you train! And Dante only met me once and I'm sure he doesn't remember, and I've never met the others! My body seems like it's held together with duct tape and chicken wire. I'm doing pretty good but I'm not 20, 40 or even 50! You joking bastard.

My HMO has a habit of sending me to specialists for EVERYTHING. Wart needs freezing? Send him to a dermatologist. "Can't you just grab the liquid nitrogen and do it yourself?" "No, it's against policy". So that means a ton of expensive testing from specialists trying to justify their existence.

Bottom line....I'm fine with my blood results, I'm not overly concerned with my liver and kidneys, cancer, etc. The only thing that freaks me out is the auto-immune hepatitis postive tests (now negative). Yeah, my ALT and AST were pretty high, but that was clearly due to the cycle. I just *do not* want auto-immune hepatitis, that would mean no more juice, and more importantly, I couldn't get my drink on anymore (it's not a regular thing, but I *DO* like to get my drink on from time to time). So....and only one person has really addressed the issue....can anyone shed any additional light on the flip-flopping anti-smooth muscle antibody tests and what my true concerns should be for that? It flipped positive well after my last cycle, and there seems to be no reason for it to have flipped back negative at this point and I want to know why, dammit!

Here are some relevant graphs.
 

Attachments

  • Creatinine.jpg
    Creatinine.jpg
    28.1 KB · Views: 56
  • BUN.png
    BUN.png
    137 KB · Views: 52
  • AST.png
    AST.png
    134.8 KB · Views: 60
  • ALT.jpg
    ALT.jpg
    30.1 KB · Views: 53
Who is viewing this thread?

There are currently 0 members watching this topic

Top