91 lb. 9 year old GIRL Squats 205

[deadweight]

Actually, I have seen some very big lifts done without belts. I have been lifting for 29 years, incidentally, and generally with a belt. She didn't use a belt on the lifts this day because she really didn't want to, and I didn't think it was unsafe. I stand by that, but we're having her train with a belt again, although it is a thin belt.

Now, what is this tear you are on about "core"? Do you have examples of these injuries you are referring to as core crashes? Working abs is important, as are related areas on the side, but given that I have been lifting for longer than you have, have been to a good 100 competitions, read countless magazines and articles on the subject, and really don't know what you are talking about, can you give more of an explanation?

first i want to say..in any way im not flameing u ...What i said was simply my oppion on a young lifter and my oppion about a young lifter and there core.
What i mean by the core crashing...A weak core can make u susceptible to poor posture,lower back pain and MUSCLE INJURIES....If any of these surface it can lead to a life long injuy..Being u been lifting for 29 years u should know it takes years and years to build strenght in the core..If the core doesnt hold up then many diff injuies can happen.You see the core is what gives us stabilty in our pelvis,lower back ,hips,and abdomen ...They all work in harmony...But if the core is weak that harmony can give out..Our core is the only brance we have to surport the weight we lift...Its very important to have a strong core..I use the term core crashing ..Its just a label i perfer to use..If the core is weak it will take a toll on it and it can lead to possible injuies....
I will say again..in no way was i trying to ofen u...i didnt mean to come across like that...If i did im sorry.Considering we both are your older lifters and been around the block more then a few times we have witness alot in the game.Im like u..Ive read more then i can rememeber..I have seen many routines that are the same except they change the name...I have competed in many meets and my roots are old school..Undergound powerlifting is my roots...So,now im in a stage that im beat up but still rolling i focus more on safty ...And what i know now is that if i would have focus more on core training i would have made it much furture ....My core crashed years ago...Due to a weak core it left me with naging injuies...... My total is 100s of miles away from my best total....Im not baseing my oppion on any mags or book or links..Just by self experiacne....
Anyway,welcome to the board....its good to have another good weightlifter here......deadweight

 

[powerlifter62]

first i want to say..in any way im not flameing u ...What i said was simply my oppion on a young lifter and my oppion about a young lifter and there core.
What i mean by the core crashing...A weak core can make u susceptible to poor posture,lower back pain and MUSCLE INJURIES....If any of these surface it can lead to a life long injuy..Being u been lifting for 29 years u should know it takes years and years to build strenght in the core..If the core doesnt hold up then many diff injuies can happen.You see the core is what gives us stabilty in our pelvis,lower back ,hips,and abdomen ...They all work in harmony...But if the core is weak that harmony can give out..Our core is the only brance we have to surport the weight we lift...Its very important to have a strong core..I use the term core crashing ..Its just a label i perfer to use..If the core is weak it will take a toll on it and it can lead to possible injuies....
I will say again..in no way was i trying to ofen u...i didnt mean to come across like that...If i did im sorry.Considering we both are your older lifters and been around the block more then a few times we have witness alot in the game.Im like u..Ive read more then i can rememeber..I have seen many routines that are the same except they change the name...I have competed in many meets and my roots are old school..Undergound powerlifting is my roots...So,now im in a stage that im beat up but still rolling i focus more on safty ...And what i know now is that if i would have focus more on core training i would have made it much furture ....My core crashed years ago...Due to a weak core it left me with naging injuies...... My total is 100s of miles away from my best total....Im not baseing my oppion on any mags or book or links..Just by self experiacne....
Anyway,welcome to the board....its good to have another good weightlifter here......deadweight

Let me quote my wife who is looking over my shoulder: "yes training the core is important, and not training the core properly could cause problems, and we appreciate you being concerned about possible problems our daughter can have with improper training. Now (hit to my head) stop arguing with him and let it go (last sentence directed to me)"

 

[AllTheWay]

My wife also spent a lot of her formative years on a farm. Farming is necessary, I agree, but 3 year olds breaking horses is not "necessary". It may be an OK thing to do, that I can't judge (I've spent virtually no time on farms). But you have leveled a lot of criticism against my wife and me, and against the concept of kids lifting. My daughter is vastly safer in carefully supervised workouts than she would be trying to break a horse. No bar, whatever weight is on it, has ever turned around and kicked or stomped on the lifter.

first, welcome to the iron den.

i didnt say i was breaking them, i just said i was riding them. a young child on the back of horse that isnt broke is common. the weight and demands are not so much. i have clients come in all the time with young children that are riding young unbroke horses. so there is a difference in being in the back and riding them and breaking them which is placing demands on them.

as parents it is our job to make decisions for our children because they dont have the knowledge to make good and appropriate choices. my son is very good with dogs and cats but i dont let him around ones that might cause him harm. he would be petting them all and if i used the theory of he loves them so he should be allowed to do it under supervision then he would get bitten because even under supervision animals can react fast and bad things can happen. the nicest dog can bite a childs face in less than a blink of an eye. so yes you can supervise but you cant stop bad things from happenin all the time so as a parent we need to look at the consequences and say, this isnt safe so therefore im not going to allow it even though the child wants to do it. i tell my kids no all the time because i dont want them to get hurt because i have more experience and i understand the different things that can happen when they dont.

as a veterinarian i am fortunate because we get to do way more invasive research than they can in humans. we can apply stress and then kill the animal and do tons of study on the results. unlike all the research that they do in humans because you cant take out a childs vertebrae and look at it under the microscope and say that the weight applied has done this or resulted in that. plus, very few children are doing this kind of work so there isnt much research in general on the subject because there isnt an money behind it. so just because there are a handful of studies that say its ok doesnt mean that it is because there arent any true "test" subjects that have had their bones taken out and monitored and looked at etc etc. being a racetrack vet for many years i have spent countless hours researching and going to meetings. race horses are started at about 18m of age in training. they are running races as 2 yo. the kentucky derby horses are only 3 years old. there is countless papers and research on the stress of bone in the racehorse. they push test horses then kill them and look at the remodeling done to the bone and compare it to horses that havent been on the track. so when i say i am concerned it is only because you dont know the forces that you are putting on your young daughters boney structure and joints. it is very impressive what she is doing and she is incredibly strong but can you say that you arent allowing her to do damage to her skeletal structure? i can tell you that the forces placed on the bones of young growing horses is extreme and the bone remodels greatly to compensate for it. how much change are you forcing her skeleton to do and do you know the long term effects of that?

my dad worked us girls like we were boys on the farm. we did everything a boy would have done and more. my oldest sister was short and very strong and dad used that all the time. she worked hard and pushed her body to the limit bucking hay and moving stuff etc etc. when she was 20yrs old she had to have back surgery to fix 3 ruptured discs. the doctors were amazed at the damage and changes in her vertebrae. she has had chronic back problems her whole life. i can guarentee you that if my dad could go back and do it all over again, he wouldnt have asked her to do what he did. yes she could do it but her skeleton wasnt ready for those forces. once again, as a parent it is our responsiblity to make choices for our children and to help them make choices that are right for them in the long term and not just the short term. your daughter at 9 cant understand the long term consequences to what she is doing right now. does that make it ok for her to do something that is potentially going to cause her a lifetime of pain? i dont know, that is every parents choice to make. i can tell you that i let my kids do bodyweight exercises and they occasionally play lift the 10# db that i have lying around. and we talk about them going to the gym with mamma and i encourage that in them but i also tell them that it isnt going to happen until they are teenagers and i tell them why. it is too hard on their growing bones and i want them to be strong and not hurt themselves. do they understand what i am telling them, probably not but they know that there is a reason for why they cant right now and they also know that they will be able to do it when they are old enough. they know that mamma wants them to grow up healthy and strong.

anyway, i dont know if any of this makes any sense. im not trying to be critical in a bad way it is just that i have seen the damage done to young animals bones. i have seen their legs snap off in a race, i have seen their soft tissues blow apart when it shouldnt. it just saddens me, that is all. your daughter has so much talent just like the young super horses and yet how many of them win the kentucky derby and then only race once or twice more because they are broken down? to be a star at 9 is amazing but what is the long term cost of that?

 

[Rottenrogue]

Welcome to the forum.I do hope you stick around. It is very easy to judge when you are on the other side of the fence.

I think the lack of belt threw me the most. With that being said I rarely use a belt on all of my lifts.I have built my core up over the years without a belt.So to see a child lifting a max lift without one immediatly gave me a negative impression.
I get flack for not wearing a belt alot .
How long has she been lifting? We have a 9 year old and an 11 year old that come out and lift in the garage but not with that intensity.They come when they want and arent focused enough to go anywhere at this point.

With her being so young arent you concerned that she is going to wear herself out at a young age? You have been lifting a long time you know what I am talking about.We all see it.The ice packs the need for more gear .The smell of DMSO in the air at a meet .I said this in another thread ,but I have seen it in my sport.Younguns come in fast and furious and they have a lifting span of a few years.
I am a mother to so bear with my questions.I am not flaming you .I am curious to hear your thoughts .
On a positive note How proud you must be that she is involved in this with you.My oldest son started competing with me in strongman at 17 years old.I know it is a great feeling to have your child by your side.

 

[powerlifter62]

Welcome to the forum.I do hope you stick around. It is very easy to judge when you are on the other side of the fence.

I think the lack of belt threw me the most. With that being said I rarely use a belt on all of my lifts.I have built my core up over the years without a belt.So to see a child lifting a max lift without one immediatly gave me a negative impression.
I get flack for not wearing a belt alot .
How long has she been lifting? We have a 9 year old and an 11 year old that come out and lift in the garage but not with that intensity.They come when they want and arent focused enough to go anywhere at this point.

With her being so young arent you concerned that she is going to wear herself out at a young age? You have been lifting a long time you know what I am talking about.We all see it.The ice packs the need for more gear .The smell of DMSO in the air at a meet .I said this in another thread ,but I have seen it in my sport.Younguns come in fast and furious and they have a lifting span of a few years.
I am a mother to so bear with my questions.I am not flaming you .I am curious to hear your thoughts .
On a positive note How proud you must be that she is involved in this with you.My oldest son started competing with me in strongman at 17 years old.I know it is a great feeling to have your child by your side.

Hi. I appreciate the nice welcome from everyone. As to my daughter, she has been lifting since April 2010. My preference is for her to wear a belt, but it is not something I feel strongly about, as it is less protective than many people think. However, my wife and I talked about it and have decided that, going forward, we want her to wear a belt on her heavier lifts. Over Naomi's protests, but we are the parents.

I'm a big fan of ice, so if she hurts herself in karate, camp, basketball, or lifting, we are quick to use ice. No DMSO, ever. No supportive gear, other than getting her to wear a belt. While it may seem otherwise with her extraordinary achievement, I am keeping her progress measured, and her workouts balanced. I'm for more concerned with her long term than her short term.

As to her focus and intensity, no question that she has learned that well, and that has been an important part of her being able to accomplish what she did.

Will she burn out, or get tired of this? I don't know. That is up to her. Her mother and I will be supportive of a wide variety of choices she may make, which certainly include moving on from lifting. While she does this, we will certainly be maximally supportive and encouraging. If some mistake this for pushing her or projecting our own wishes onto her, that is their error.

 

[powerlifter62]

To ATW,

First thank you for the welcome. I always like a good sharing of ideas, and certainly am always looking for ways to take best care of my daughter, which certainly doesn't equal being over-protective, but at the same time need avoid being reckless.

I just spoke with my wife about your post. I'm sorry about confusing riding an unbroken horse with breaking a horse. However, riding an unbroken horse can still be dangerous, which from your vast experience with animals, you can certainly acknowledge.

The experience your sister had was very sad, and should absolutely be held as an example of what to avoid. As I said, my wife spent a lot of time on a farm growing up, and has had quite a bit of experience bucking hay and doing other farm chores. While there are limited similarities, there are vast differences between doing farm chores and powerlifting workouts. Powerlifting workouts are structured, focused and BRIEF. She will not build anything even remotely resembling the fatigue of days or weeks on end of heavy farm work. We probably just need to agree to disagree, but on my own behalf, I will say that I am very careful with her workouts. Perhaps she set the women's world record at 97 lbs because she is just naturally that strong?

 

[deadweight]

It's a really good forum. We all tend to make judgments over the internet. The truth is usually somewhere in the middle. I hope you stick around.

Iron siad it all here..the truth is somewhere in the middle....I find this topic to be very interesting...Alot can be learned here people.....dw

 

[AllTheWay]

agree to disagree, i can do that certainly in regards to farm work vs powerlifting. they are definately different in many ways.

i will still stand firm on my thoughts on the forces applied to her skeleton only because i have 15+ years of experience in seeing the damage done to the immature skeletons of animals. that being said, i certainly dont expect you to stop supporting her in her dreams and desires but maybe just as a word of caution. i can tell you of many trainers that wished they had listened to my advice after a traumatic injury to their young and talented horse. some of them not pushed hard at all but because of their natural talent they exceeded what their body could bear. so you may take it or leave it.

have a most fantastic day. and i think it is a great idea to make her start wearing a belt. there are years of experience on this board and not all of them the same so i hope if nothing else we can all learn something from each other and maybe at times sit back and reconsider our thoughts on something and other times be built up and encouraged!

 

[SAD]

So are you saying NO stress on the joints for children in the form of free-weights? You've made many absolute statements in this thread, but you should take your own advice and reconsider your thoughts. I've posted studies, which you referred to as "a few" and said they didn't prove anything, yet your "proof" is personal anecdotes about horses. Children will find things to pick up, carry, flip over, etc., so why not have them do so in a structured and supervised environment (with appropriate weight and form)? Please be more open to studies done on HUMANS and don't be so stubborn, lol.

agree to disagree, i can do that certainly in regards to farm work vs powerlifting. they are definately different in many ways.

i will still stand firm on my thoughts on the forces applied to her skeleton only because i have 15+ years of experience in seeing the damage done to the immature skeletons of animals. that being said, i certainly dont expect you to stop supporting her in her dreams and desires but maybe just as a word of caution. i can tell you of many trainers that wished they had listened to my advice after a traumatic injury to their young and talented horse. some of them not pushed hard at all but because of their natural talent they exceeded what their body could bear. so you may take it or leave it.

have a most fantastic day. and i think it is a great idea to make her start wearing a belt. there are years of experience on this board and not all of them the same so i hope if nothing else we can all learn something from each other and maybe at times sit back and reconsider our thoughts on something and other times be built up and encouraged!

 

[porky little keg]

first i want to say..in any way im not flameing u ...What i said was simply my oppion on a young lifter and my oppion about a young lifter and there core.
What i mean by the core crashing...A weak core can make u susceptible to poor posture,lower back pain and MUSCLE INJURIES....If any of these surface it can lead to a life long injuy..Being u been lifting for 29 years u should know it takes years and years to build strenght in the core..If the core doesnt hold up then many diff injuies can happen.You see the core is what gives us stabilty in our pelvis,lower back ,hips,and abdomen ...They all work in harmony...But if the core is weak that harmony can give out..Our core is the only brance we have to surport the weight we lift...Its very important to have a strong core..I use the term core crashing ..Its just a label i perfer to use..If the core is weak it will take a toll on it and it can lead to possible injuies....
I will say again..in no way was i trying to ofen u...i didnt mean to come across like that...If i did im sorry.Considering we both are your older lifters and been around the block more then a few times we have witness alot in the game.Im like u..Ive read more then i can rememeber..I have seen many routines that are the same except they change the name...I have competed in many meets and my roots are old school..Undergound powerlifting is my roots...So,now im in a stage that im beat up but still rolling i focus more on safty ...And what i know now is that if i would have focus more on core training i would have made it much furture ....My core crashed years ago...Due to a weak core it left me with naging injuies...... My total is 100s of miles away from my best total....Im not baseing my oppion on any mags or book or links..Just by self experiacne....
Anyway,welcome to the board....its good to have another good weightlifter here......deadweight

I have to respectfully disagree with you DW. I do agree that developing strong core muscles is important, but the proof is in the pudding. She is squatting 2x+ her bodyweight without a belt and without hunching over and doing a goodmorning..... I'm going out on a limb here and am going to guess that in order for her to do this her core must be plenty strong. Quite frankly, most of the training I have my younger lifters do ( admittedly not this heavy ) is without a belt until their heaviest sets. Lifting without a belt until you really need it IS how to develop a strong core. I'll bet that this kid has a stronger "core" than all of the goof-balls doing crunches on a beach ball combined.....

Maybe it's just the powerlifting fan coming out and being amazed by this girl's strength.... but I really can't see anything wrong with this. If it were a video of a 9 year old boy slaughtering other kids on a wrestling mat or football field everyone would be applauding him.... but for whatever reason people ( not you in particular, sorry if this comes off that way) are finding fault with this..... especially after PL62 commenting about how she lifts because she likes to and doesn't care if she burns out because he'll be proud no matter what she does with her life...... absolutely nothing wrong here. I sent the video link to all of my buddies too.... 10 out of 10 powerlifters agree: this kid is AWESOME.

 

[Amma]

Is everybody ignoring the plethora of studies I found? I'm not arguing for a 9yr old to be maxing out, but I am stating my opinion that it can be beneficial and safe to have your child start lifting weights at an early age.

I'm right there with you. People's knee jerk reactions to kids lifting isn't generally grounded in science and research. Kids SHOULD be training instead of sitting in front of the TV stuffing their faces. Lifting will be at the core of any sport they choose to play as they get older. Kids run, play, climb and engage in a crazy amount of sports for any little or big person.

At age 7 my daughter started box squatting with PVC, DL and lots of conditioning work. She is learning form and we are supervising and teaching her. I saw no evidence that girl in the vid was working near max, my bet is in the 85% range. My kids generally don't train over 75% based on our own interpretation of their straining.

The concept of damaging growth plates is old skool and has been debunked.

 

[Amma]

Watch this and her reaction to the belt. The size of a buckle on a belt is the same for a kid or an adult. The only thing that changes on the belts is the width of the belt to go around the waist. It's painful for a kid. This is totally cute tho. This is what lifting looks like with a 7 year old. She's the size of a 10 year old.

You get the idea. There are some vids on our account with our 11 year old lifting too.