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2nd cycle results and thoughts on 3rd cycle

Rein

Rein

MuscleHead
Sep 10, 2010
1,241
128
#1
For those who don't know, my first cycle consisted of d-bol at 20mgs and restandol at 240mgs for 6 weeks. I gained a total of 27lbs of which i kept about 20 after my 3 week pct with 20mgs Nolvadex.

A few months later, i started my second cycle which consisted 30mgs d-bol for the first 4 weeks and test e (pharm grade) at 500-600mgs per week divided in two injections for 11 weeks. Then i waited 3 weeks on which i only took 20mgs d-bol as a pre-workout supplement and 900iu HCG oer week in three divided shots (i used hcg throughout the entire cycle at 600iu per week).

As of today, I am on the second week of my pct. No side effects to report so far. I am worried though because i have lost a lot of weight... I gained a total of 18lbs (I would have gained more if my eating was better at times) and so far i have lost about 9lbs. I don't look like i have lost any muscle mass and my muscles are hard, hell, i am even gaining naturally even on pct.

I am continuously losing size from my waste. I may just be losing fat and water and adding muscle naturally, but still, i have lost most of my strength and weight gained.

I am very skeptical about using test next time, even at the range of 500-600mgs. Test is the best, yes but i got very intense body hair growth in places i didn't have hair and apparently it made me hold a ton of water plus i started feeling it work at about week 6-7 and i gained most of the muscle mass from weeks 7/8-11....

I was a fool to believe that proviron would have protected me from the excess water retention. Next time i am going to use A-dex at 0.25mgs eod and drop proviron completely.

It honestly does nothing more than enhancing one's libido but i get that from test as well so i don't see why i have to tax my liver even more by taking 100mgs Proviron ed for months...

I am open to cycle suggestions now for my third run. I am really tempted by EQ but it takes forever to kick in and clear the system. I certainly don't want to wait 5 weeks before starting my pct so this leaves me with other alternatives. NPP perhaps?
 
bigrobbie

bigrobbie

MuscleHead
Sep 19, 2010
523
148
#2
I'm tellin ya bro...throw in Clenbuterol and also instead of NPP just run Tren Ace... A Test, Tren, Clen, Adex and throw in some Anavar last 6 weeks...you'll have little water retention problems.
 
Rein

Rein

MuscleHead
Sep 10, 2010
1,241
128
#3
I would prefer to avoid both clen and tren ace. I don't want to find out whether i am prone to tren cough or not. Besides i want to leave some free play for later, so no tren for me.

I have an already fast metabolism and even 20mcg's clen make my body temperature go so high that it actually is uncomfortable at times.

I don't mind water retention at all, i just want to keep it under control next time.
 
AWARE72

AWARE72

MuscleHead
Oct 17, 2010
323
18
#4
i started my second cycle which consisted 30mgs d-bol for the first 4 weeks and test e (pharm grade) at 500-600mgs per week divided in two injections for 11 weeks. Then i waited 3 weeks on which i only took 20mgs d-bol as a pre-workout supplement and 900iu HCG oer week in three divided shots (i used hcg throughout the entire cycle at 600iu per week).

As of today, I am on the second week of my pct. No side effects to report so far. I am worried though because i have lost a lot of weight... I gained a total of 18lbs (I would have gained more if my eating was better at times) and so far i have lost about 9lbs. I don't look like i have lost any muscle mass and my muscles are hard, hell, i am even gaining naturally even on pct.

I am very skeptical about using test next time, even at the range of 500-600mgs. Test is the best, yes but i got very intense body hair growth in places i didn't have hair and apparently it made me hold a ton of water plus i started feeling it work at about week 6-7 and i gained most of the muscle mass from weeks 7/8-11....

I was a fool to believe that proviron would have protected me from the excess water retention. Next time i am going to use A-dex at 0.25mgs eod and drop proviron completely.

I am open to cycle suggestions now for my third run. I am really tempted by EQ but it takes forever to kick in and clear the system. I certainly don't want to wait 5 weeks before starting my pct so this leaves me with other alternatives. NPP perhaps?
Hey bro...

So what does you PCT look like?

As for proviron I'm using that @ 50mg/D primarly because Proviron possesses the ability to bind SHBG at a high rate. By doing so other co-administered AAS (or endogenous testosterone) remained in an unbound/free state. Also if it help with the sex drive department thats a plus.. I would not count on this alone to combat estrogen. I choose to use aromasin. I had it as much as 10mg a day then drop to 10mg EOD and when I ramp my test up here shortly I might end up @ 20mg/D. This will also most likly be part of of PCT.

you mention you would of gain more if your eating was better? Well IMO that is just as important going into PCT.

As being skeptical about using test? Test will help you with muscle protein synthesis, however if you do not provide the need amino acids need to build muscle, well then it's not going to build muscle. Your diet is key during cycle and PCT.

As for EQ...My understanding is that half live is 14 days so not sure where your getting 5 weeks...It can effect slow and continuous muscle mass and strength gains over a prolonged period, and generally cycles with this drug tend to be quite long because of this fact. IDK

Me personally I would wait for test fully "kick in" (2weeks) then add an oral on top. The oral for added strenght, and the test to assit in muscle protein synthesis(builds muscle)... .
 
Rein

Rein

MuscleHead
Sep 10, 2010
1,241
128
#5
Thanks for your reply bro. I have been working out for many years and people who know me, are aware of my knowledge on bodybuilding. I have been eating every 2,5-3 hours, i did drink about 3 liters of water every day and i also know all the stuff you said about proviron.

Both my eating and my workout routine are fine tuned, it's just that i couldn't eat every 2-3 hours for an entire week in the middle of my cycle and having the metabolism i have, it make my appetite hit the bottom and for the following weeks, i honestly had to strive to make it come back. I force fed my self like i haven't before.

In case you didn't notice bro,i said i have kept most of my lbm gains and that i am losing fat and water now.

Right now i am 20mgs Nolva ed, ZMA and creatine.
 
AWARE72

AWARE72

MuscleHead
Oct 17, 2010
323
18
#6
OK....

It just sound like you did not have good overall result on your last cycle...IDK....To be honest I'm doing some "out of box things" that most would think I'm crazy....Slin with no carb, fasting, no carbs PWO, larger meals less often. So far these protocol are working well for me...We will see...

Also
EQ will help with the appetite and have you every considered GHRP-6 that also increase appetite...

Anyhow....Good luck reaching your goals....
 
Rein

Rein

MuscleHead
Sep 10, 2010
1,241
128
#7
OK....

It just sound like you did not have good overall result on your last cycle...IDK....To be honest I'm doing some "out of box things" that most would think I'm crazy....Slin with no carb, fasting, no carbs PWO, larger meals less often. So far these protocol are working well for me...We will see...

Also
EQ will help with the appetite and have you every considered GHRP-6 that also increase appetite...

Anyhow....Good luck reaching your goals....
Each one to his own i guess brother. Keep doing what works for you and i wish you the best of luck with your goals as well! :)

Regarding EQ, the undecylenate ester is longer than the Decanoate ester which takes at least a months time to clear.
 
HawaiianPride.

HawaiianPride.

Senior Member
Oct 21, 2010
152
51
#8
For those who don't know, my first cycle consisted of d-bol at 20mgs and restandol at 240mgs for 6 weeks. I gained a total of 27lbs of which i kept about 20 after my 3 week pct with 20mgs Nolvadex.

Impressive gains man^ Did you get blood work done?

A few months later, i started my second cycle which consisted 30mgs d-bol for the first 4 weeks and test e (pharm grade) at 500-600mgs per week divided in two injections for 11 weeks. Then i waited 3 weeks on which i only took 20mgs d-bol as a pre-workout supplement and 900iu HCG oer week in three divided shots (i used hcg throughout the entire cycle at 600iu per week).

As of today, I am on the second week of my pct. No side effects to report so far. I am worried though because i have lost a lot of weight... I gained a total of 18lbs (I would have gained more if my eating was better at times) and so far i have lost about 9lbs. I don't look like i have lost any muscle mass and my muscles are hard, hell, i am even gaining naturally even on pct.

Are your macros the same as they were during your cycle? Since the exogenous hormones aren't present anymore, you'll sometimes need to increase your daily macros during PCT to compensate for the new radical mass previous attained. I've noticed this assisted with maintaining gains with my personal experience.

I am continuously losing size from my waste. I may just be losing fat and water and adding muscle naturally, but still, i have lost most of my strength and weight gained.

Yes, always take into account water being dropped when weight decreases. Some will confuse this with LBM. Especially if strength decreases as well.

I am very skeptical about using test next time, even at the range of 500-600mgs. Test is the best, yes but i got very intense body hair growth in places i didn't have hair and apparently it made me hold a ton of water plus i started feeling it work at about week 6-7 and i gained most of the muscle mass from weeks 7/8-11....

Although the compounds technically start working immediately, physical and appearance noticeably changes in week 4-6 with long ester Testosterone here as well, as with most. This is why I usually keep these compounds 12-14 weeks to get the benefit of the hormones for roughly 6-8 weeks.

The water can be controlled with lowering dosages, diet/AI's and other AAS, even. I wouldn't rule out Test from future cycles due to this when it can be remedied. Hair growth can be controlled with dosages as well. Always use the least amount you can while still receiving gains to limit side effects.

I was a fool to believe that proviron would have protected me from the excess water retention. Next time i am going to use A-dex at 0.25mgs eod and drop proviron completely.

Now your thinking. If you can afford to throw a little more money out, I would opt for Aromasin 10mg EOD instead. Raises ig-f, improves lipid profile and no estro rebound due to it being a suicidal inhibitor. Dex lowers IGF.

It honestly does nothing more than enhancing one's libido but i get that from test as well so i don't see why i have to tax my liver even more by taking 100mgs Proviron ed for months...

Also, since Testosterone will act in the same way with regards to libido enhancement, your Proviron could have been masked in this respect by the parent hormone. It has it's benefits, but it's not essential.

I am open to cycle suggestions now for my third run. I am really tempted by EQ but it takes forever to kick in and clear the system. I certainly don't want to wait 5 weeks before starting my pct so this leaves me with other alternatives. NPP perhaps?

What your goals? I could layout a few cycle ideas for you.
Bold. Do you have blood work planned post-PCT?
 
Rein

Rein

MuscleHead
Sep 10, 2010
1,241
128
#9
Bold. Do you have blood work planned post-PCT?
Thanks for your answers brother! They were very helpful! I always do blood work before and after cycles just to be sure than thing's aren't getting out of control. Next time i am going to try Aromasin and see what that does for me. :)

My goals is to keep gaining muscle mass. It's almost impossible to get more than 15-16% bf and even if i get this high, i am still very lean and very well defined. I am constantly on bulking mode bro. :)

For my next cycle i would like to try a-bombs over d-bol to see what that does for me and to shock my body a little bit.

What i originally had planned to do as my third cycle was this:

Weeks 1-3: 100mgs Test prop every Mon,Wed,Fri
Weeks 1-6: 50mgs Anapolon
Weeks 1-12: 750mgs Testoviron (doesn't contain any test prop)
Weeks 3-15: 300iu HCG e4d
Weeks 16-19/21: 20mgs Nolvadex
Weeks 1-12: 10mgs Aromasin eod
 
HawaiianPride.

HawaiianPride.

Senior Member
Oct 21, 2010
152
51
#10
Drol is a great compound. But always look at its advantages contrasted with its disadvantages if it's your first time, so you'll know what to expect. Since your RBC will be dramatically increased initially, you might find yourself actually packing on more weight than you'd expected.

Cycle looks simple enough. You got a nice combination of jump starts there. HCG dose and duration look good, AI looks good. PCT would be insufficient for me but more power to you if you can recover off Nolva at that dose. I have nothing to add here. It's well planned out from head to toe.

Got anything to control cholesterol and BP?
 
Rein

Rein

MuscleHead
Sep 10, 2010
1,241
128
#11
Drol is a great compound. But always look at its advantages contrasted with its disadvantages if it's your first time, so you'll know what to expect. Since your RBC will be dramatically increased initially, you might find yourself actually packing on more weight than you'd expected.

Cycle looks simple enough. You got a nice combination of jump starts there. HCG dose and duration look good, AI looks good. PCT would be insufficient for me but more power to you if you can recover off Nolva at that dose. I have nothing to add here. It's well planned out from head to toe.

Got anything to control cholesterol and BP?
Thanks bro! I hope this isn't too much for a third cycle. Thankfully i don't have issues with recovery but i might need to do 40mgs of nolva for the first week.

For cholesterol and BP i will use various OTC supplements and for general health and liver i will use Liv52DS which is an amazing supplement!

I have two more questions though.

Would there be any problem if I did 50mgs of test prop instead of 100? It would be a lot more comfortable to inject 1,5cc's rather than two and i will be able to inject into my delts as well.

Regarding drol, i am going to buy only a small amount (probably 3 week supply) just to see what it does for me. If i like it, i will get some more, if i don't i will switch to d-bol.
 
jdjack

jdjack

MuscleHead
Sep 22, 2010
568
32
#12
IMO bro you probably don't need to increase the Test to 750. I've done quite a few cycles and still don't use that much. You manipulate your diet. Yeah I know its tougher, and you can add fat if you aren't exact, but you may need to, to put on more mass. Look around for AJ's post on Carb Cycling. It may be what you need to bulk up and minimize the fat. You're starting to see when we say DIET is the most important thing. Tough thing with it is that you really have to stick with a thought on a diet and see what happens, and then when you learn 'what works for you', you've gained 20lbs and its stops working well and then its time to tweak it again. Yeah that's the bitch of what we do.

I see many guys who run 2, 3, 4g's of stuff all the time, and wonder why they don't spend more time on their diet. We know AAS are vilified, but they are caustic to our organs when pushed hard all the time. Our kidneys, spleen, gallbladder, etc don't heal like our livers do. Take it for what its worth. Its your life, just my opinion. Good luck bro.
 
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